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• ->Isabela Background: -Refugee parents, grew up in a diverse community with little resources in Brooklyn and Chinatown -Got into Prep4Prep, a rigorous education program that placed minority students into elite private schools; she wanted to take what opportunity she was given as far as possible -Felt pressure to speak for underrepresented communities (be her community’s Spiderman) Early Career: -Executive Director for the Asian Pacific American Caucus, Prez/CEO APAICS… realized politics wasn’t what she wanted to do, it was just a linear career path from where she started -Thought of being a music manager because loved live music…realized that was similar to politics… wanted to coach to help people find their voice and courage [First Audio Clip: Went to a liberal university where learning about how to be an activist meant pushing against old structures; as a coach she learned that being creative can be more impactful; need perspective and a balance of pushing and creating] Currently: -Works with a diverse group of people since humanity and struggle are universal. However, still really passionate about women and Asian American communities -Looking forward to working with intergenerational women’s empowerment [Second Audio Clip: When she was younger/in her twenties, she saw the Asian American community as a struggle based community that needed a voice. She now see’s it as a community that still struggles but is strong and works together to get by; a community that she can support rather than be a hero to.] Relations to course: -Gloria helps many people of color, including Asian American women, become better leaders in their personal and work lives -She realized that you can’t just push to change old structures. This is similar to the Art of Social Change article we read where, for change to occur, you have to consider social and cultural context -Gloria works with people who have been influenced by different cultural values (ex: parents valuing boys over girls) -Exemplifies trend of future generations getting more involved in politics and activism than first generation -New information we learned: -Many second generation may feel like they need to take advantage of opportunity available to them (which can change into feelings of obligation) or they may feel like they are not deserving of the opportunity available to them -Goals of immigrants and second generation are very different. First generation mainly focuses on getting by or bringing family over; second generation focuses more on improving life and leaving a legacy ->Bryanna Planning Pre-interview research (website, Linkedin, part of her book on Amazon) Used background information to prepare key questions The questions you ask can influence the type of information you are able to gather, but Gloria was talkative, informative, & answered before we could ask Open ended (“Can you explain the type of environment you grew up in?”) Close ended (“Who would you say had the biggest influence on your drive?”) Probing questions *Clip #1* Talking about things that may have discouraged her during her journey; she said the pressure she always felt to take full advantage of her opportunities and to milk every privilege to the fullest ended up becoming discouraging for her (Harvard) In 20s: she did everything she felt she was supposed to do (cared about policy implications for AA communities, so she went to capitol hill - and became executive director of the CAUCUS. Then became President-CEO of the sister nonprofit of that CAUCUS [APAICS]) Today: She’s not trying to milk priviledge or climb anymore *clip #1* Bc I probed her, we got a better understanding and good information on her career choice Prepare logistics for the interview Team interviewing approach: Original plan: divided questions equally by section; Primary note taker = Whoever wasn’t questioning, would take notes I ended up conducting most of interview and Isabela took notes Video conference → Telephone (~1 hour long) Conducting Type of interview: Unstructured (seeking her opinion/perspective, questions flexible and dependent on the interview & responses) Friendly (professional) conversation Active listening - *clip #2* - using her passion to find her career; i repeat to understand Responding to challenging situations (realized info about children private so didn’t ask anymore) Cues: My non-verbal: Voice (loud, clear, confident)(avoid fillers, “uh” “so”); encouraging feedback; repeat when understand; rephrasing when don’t Documenting Isabela took most notes *Clip #3* - shows Gloria’s personality. Began and ended interview speaking about Asian-American relations (1)
• Amy Hall is a Chinese-American woman who was raised in Connecticut and a suburb of Philadelphia. In our 45- minute interview she always returned to the idea that since a young age she had always been interested in humanitarian work, serving others any way she could. Ms. Hall mentioned in the interview that her experience growing up as a Chinese-American girl in predominantly white spaces made her want to help others who also felt left out of society. She has been able to achieve that goal through working with a high-end fashion company called Eileen Fisher for the past 25 years as both the Director of Social Consciousness and, as of earlier this month, Vice President. As Director of Social Consciousness, Ms. Hall had the combined multilingual and cross-cultural experience to effectively negotiate with the many people in Eileen Fisher’s supply chain. Eileen Fisher also works very hard to switch over to totally environmentally friendly and sustainable practices, from labor reform among their suppliers and workers to changing the fibers they use and even recycling old Eileen Fisher products into new products for limited edition sale. We have an example of reconstructed recycled clothes here on the slide. This is just one of the many styles offered in the new collection. Projects like this has a huge impact on the environment. I don’t know if you guys know this but the fashion industry has a huge waste issue. The financial success of the fashion industry literally hinges on the fast rotation of in versus out styles. Besides this, clothes are often made with plastic or synthetic materials and these fabrics go through a washing machine particles from the clothes called microplastics seep into the water supply, and since they’re microscopic they can’t be filtered out by treatment systems. (clip1). One of my favorite parts of the interview was when Ms. Hall described how she learned from a large scale mistake. For some background, Eileen Fisher wanted to find a way to give the workers making its clothes healthcare but after getting one supplier on board, they learned the hard way about a flaw in the plan. (clip2). I think this was a really important part of the interview because it reflected the fact that American practices and moral values are not applicable everywhere else in the world. It reminded me a lot of our numerous in class discussions about American moral imperialism and how just throwing solutions tailored for US social problems won’t magically fix social problems abroad. Poverty and the working class are not the same everywhere and I think this excerpt perfectly demonstrates that if U.S citizens actually want to create change abroad you actually have to be on the ground, working with locals to create lasting solutions they actually support and want for themselves and their families. 3:50 - on diversity 5:00 - interest and language, Spanish→ Chinese 7:00 - work in human rights, how she got interested. 10:40 - work in fundraising isn’t exactly what she hoped it would be 13:30 - community relations manager four years into working fr EF, commitment to ppl in supply chain 22:07 - 23:20 - EF and sustainable practices, fibers 23:30 - Ms. Hall speaking about failure and learning from mistakes 23:50 - 26:04 - The Mistake (clip2) We centered our first bulk of questions around her early life, growing up in Connecticut and Philadelphia, and then her college career. From there we delved into more detailed questions about her classes, her major, studying abroad, and if she had any role models in her life. After that, we tried to direct the interview into her time working for Eileen Fisher, INC. Before Eileen Fisher, she works for three non-profits, and found that her skillset rested in fundraising. Yet, she found this wasn’t a great fit for her personality. Fundraising wasn’t satisfying and it didn’t bring her the impact she had, it made her feel too far removed. She wished to work hands on within the communities she helps. It was difficult to manifest what she wanted to happen, happen. She walked away from fundraising at the age of 32. She ended up getting an administrative position, as the assistant to a CEO of a small, fashion company. The CEO ended up leaving the company a few months later. — Four years later, she was given the title community relations manager. This was Eileen Fisher. She has now been working for the company for 25 years. We backtracked a bit after this bulk of conversation, asking about her time studying abroad in China in 1979. We asked if she had ever been back to China after that. She goes quite frequently, once every year or two now to visit suppliers for Eileen Fisher. Questions about Eileen Fisher, sustainability and human rights that would eventually conclude the interview. Aracely and I truly tried to capture her life and everything she has built and grown into within the short frame of our interview, and Amy was more than willing to speak on her life, even without prodding. (1)
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• 1 2 Took turns asking questions We asked a lot of active listening questions and asked for more specifics based on something she said Open-ended questions Words of encouragement “right, wow that’s interesting” Very long interview – 52 minutes Non-verbal cues – unable bc skype issue but she was smiling a lot while we were on and joking She was very professional – cautious of giving too much of her own opinions, stuck to facts, answered with examples Duration and date of interview What did our questions center around How were the answers we received 3 (1)
• 1 Joshua Kim & Yawen Tang AAS 307 Final Report SECTION ONE (5 points) Person interviewed: Sarah Park Interviewee’s title or position: Manager of a Martin’s Cleaners in East Setauket Date, time, and length of interview: Apr.12, 8:00 am, 35mins Our objective in conducting this interview: 1. Getting to know Sarah Park’s background: How’s her family status? How’s her childhood? How many years she has been lived in United States? 2. Getting to know Sarah Park’s work: Why she works at the cleaners? Does she own the store? What she does for her work? 3. Getting to know Sarah Park’s personal life: Is the married? Is she a religious? How’s her husband and children? 4. Getting to know the role that Sarah Park plays in the U.S.-Asian relations. We wanted to know whether Sarah Park ever met any discrimination against her. Also, we wanted to figure out how Sarah Park different from American women, and how she build up the bridge and understanding between American and Asian Women. 2 SECTION TWO (10 points) Before the interview, we only had her name and the name of the cleaners’ she works at. We wanted to find her on Facebook but failed, then we figured it is possibly because her store was not that well known. Then we found her store on the google map, with all the necessary information. For an example, we had discovered that her address is at 170 NY-25A, SetauketEast Setauket, NY 11733 and the dry cleaner place was called “Martin’s French Cleaners.” Moreover, we had discovered that her workdays and work hours were 8:00 a.m.- 6:00 p.m. every day of the week besides Sundays and Mondays. Then, we started worked on the questions. Moreover, our original questions mainly focus on her work and the woman’s role she plays as a Korean American. With the help of our professor, we wrote the interview request for her in a letter, and we gave it to her in person. However, she did not reply to the letter, the most probable reason was because she was so occupied with her work. Thus, I (Yawen) went to her store again to schedule the interview time because of the lack of communication. When I talked to her, we found out that she has Korean accent, which means she immigrated to United States instead of being born here. Therefore, we changed and added questions about her immigration, and the life she had before she came to U.S. In preparation of the interview, we had fully charged our phone for recording and prepared a camera for photos and videos the day before we took the interview. We had also wore nicer clothes than usual to give off a professional attire and had practiced the interview questions beforehand so that we do not seem unprepared and as if we were reading our questions aloud for the first time. Our friends drove us to the interview site. 3 List your interview questions. What do you do on a daily basis for your job? How did you attain your current career? What was your early childhood like? Were you ever discriminated against racially? How does your career affect your family and what is their stance on it? Do you think that White Americans work harder than Asians or vice versa? How does your religious beliefs affect your life? SECTION THREE For the interview project, we got complete answers to our questions, despite Sarah Park not being fluent in English. She tried to the utmost of her abilities to give us answers that were not curtailed, but instead longer and more descriptive, in spite of the language barrier. For an example, one of the interview questions that we had asked her was “when you had came to American, what was your hardest challenge?” Her reply paraphrased was that she had arrived in America in 1982 because of her job in an airline company named CPA and worked there for a decade before quitting. Then she had gotten involved in real estate for four or five years. During that time span, she had met her husband married him, giving birth to two sons in 1986 and 1988. She also stated that they had finally opened up their dry cleaner’s store called “Martin’s French Cleaners” in 2002. As demonstrated in this example, she had answered other questions as well without us having to ask them at all to her. The questions that she answered in addition were 4 “Were you into any other career before you have attained your current job?” and “When had you first come to America?” The primary reason she had talked for a lengthy period of time was partially because we had given her positive verbal and non -verbal cues. The structure of our interview questions was mixed with simple yet specific questions and general questions. If we had simply done simple questions, we would have gotten very specific dates, nevertheless it would be meaningless without the actual content. On the other hand, if we had attained just broad questions without any specific and simple questions, our presentation would seem very vague and not professional. The simple yet specific questions were meant to complement the broad overview attained from the general question to make our presentation look professional and assert us being very knowledgeable about our subject. An example of a simple question would be that “What year did you attend your university that you had went to?” For a broad question, an example would be “please describe your early childhood.” The probing questions that we had used was “How did you do attain the current job you have presently” and “how does your job affect your family and what are their stances on this issue?” Because each of the questions covered a lot of additional information, it is considered an open ended question or a probing question. The answers to these questions were not specific, thus it had given considerable freedom to the interviewee to state information that is correlated with the issue. Since the question is not an easy question, the answer would inevitably be a complicated one covering many subtopics to answer the primary topic of the question. For an example, “how did you attain the current job you have presently.” The process that Sarah Park had used in answering this question was to mention what college she had went to which was 5 In- cheon college in Korea as well as the previous jobs regarding her as a real estate agent and a travel agent. She could have just said that I had married, and me and my husband in 2002 pooled our financial resources together in order to buy the dry cleaner store, however she had mentioned the whole backstory of the process getting there. Regarding our team strategy in completing our final interview project, Yawen and I had split the work. She had done the first slide called the “content slide” of our presentation regarding how our interviewee’s goals related to US- Asian relations and how our interviewee accomplished those goals. Also Yawen had to state how the information regarding Sarah Park related the information we have learned in class and also in terms of new information or additional information pertaining to Sarah Park. I had to do the “interview process slide” in which I had to describe the interview process such as emailing or calling the interviewee to schedule the interview as well as the interview experience. In addition, I had to mention specific verbal and non- verbal cues that we have to give Sarah Park, as well as verbal and non- verbal cues which we thought Sarah Park would express and thought we had to wary about and take into great consideration. Some of these cues were facial expressions, voice volume, voice inflection, eye contact, sighing, nail tapping, ect. Regarding the interview questions, roughly half of the questions that were used came from me while the other half came from Yawen. The interviewee did not give us any documents or references to articles to read, but she did mention how we could also interview her husband. However, since the project was only about one person and since they both worked together as co- owners of the dry cleaner’s store, we had politely refused. The husband was busy working in the back of the store, and we would have genuinely felt guilty if we had hindered the business any further with our presence making the customers feel a little uncomfortable and making the room more crowded than it had to be. 6 SECTION 4: Regarding emerging trends, Sarah Park mentioned how feminine power was weaker than today in the twenty first century. She had said how in the early 1980s she was the only female member of her family that attended college, and how it was a big step for her. Instead of discouraging her, her parents had encouraged her to do the best she can do without having any regrets of the results if they turn out to be as not as good. Sarah Park then mentioned the new academic trend which was about how even more women today attend college, and making up now over fifty percent of the total populations in colleges throughout America, outnumbering the percentage of males in college by a small degree.. Sarah Park also mentioned parents’ different interpretation of sacrifice for their offspring between Asians and Westerners. Parents making ultimate sacrifices for their children tended to be more prominent in Asian culture rather than Western culture. In other words, American families did help out their children financially, but perhaps not to the extreme degree in which Asian families sacrificed for their sons and daughters. She then stated how her family made sacrifices financially by saving every bit of their hard earned money to send her to college. Examples were that they did not go out to restaurants as often as they once did, they bought more cheap fast foods, instead of the expensive organic food products, and stopped shopping for new goods such as clothes and new cellphones altogether. This in turn, affected Sarah Park, when she became a mother of two sons who were ready to go to college. She had said how she gave up her own cell phone to save income, because there only needs to be one cellphone between her and her husband. Another example was how she said “I don’t need three meals a day, I can just eat two meals a day.” Despite this, she did not cancel any of her sons’ cellphones, which meant that 7 she still had to pay their phone bills and did not want to upset them by taking away their phones. Her sons realized this and appreciated it. In terms of her recommendations of future interviews, Sarah Park had stated how it was extremely helpful that we had sent her the interview questions beforehand, so she was prepared to answer the questions more easily and said to keep doing that from now. She had also appreciated the fact that we had come early in the morning which was the time she had said for us to come visit her. This was because during the early morning she was not very busy and had the most time to spare for the interview. Perhaps this was the reason why she did not show any negative verbal or non- verbal signs to us to leave or end the interview sooner. The fact that we had adapted to her preferences immediately due to our flexibility with time was appreciated by her as well and was she said to us to apply that to future interviews as well. Interview notes: What do you do for your job on a daily basis? Basically the cleaner’s work in our store is separate in two areas workwise. I am covering the front and my husband is covering the back. We have a tailor and presser and my husband and myself. So what we do when the customer comes in, they bring a bundle of clothes for cleaning, then i made the ticket and tag an after the cleaned garment is I take it over and inspect if it is good enough for the press, after I start it bag it and load on the computer. My husband inspects it again after it is bagged, if there is something wrong with the clothes I talk to my husband personally. Cleaning is divided in two ways, wet clean and dry clean. Some of the garment is not good enough for dry clean. The closest explanation of wet cleaning is like handwashing. 8 What was your early childhood like? My father was a banker so for that year we have to move around, because at that time, many areas did not have a bank, so my dad established a bank. We have to move towns for that year, it was when was really young in elementary school. It was a countryside, but I have that memory which was beautiful, there were rice fields, farms, and a lot of children my age who would play all day long until dawn. It was a really bright and happy experience. But by middle school my family and I had to look for the college, so I had to study a lot. “Were you ever discriminated against racially in America?” I expected it and I did not care much about what other people thought of me and the attitudes of strangers meant nothing to me. I did have a few rude cases here and there, however there was not much instances of racism here in America. “How did your career affect your family?” I could not take care of oldest son who was in ninth grade. I understood that he was not a baby, however it is was the first time that I could not take care of him because I was busy with work. My philosophy was to suffer as fully as possible and as much as possible. When my sons were in the second and fourth grade –that was the first time in which I could not take care of them. My life exists to suffer for my children. When I had arrived home, it was already dinner time. Before, I used to always be with the children twenty four hours a day besides them being in school. “Do you think that White Americans work harder or do Asian immigrants work harder?” “The circumstances that the first generation immigrant lived life differently from the Americans. America was on the top and it is economically different for white Americans versus Asian 9 immigrants. There is not much free time for us (first generation immigrants), that is the way we had lived, and of course work is different, because we have to work in order to survive. Our attitudes are also different than Americans, because we feel like we don’t belong here. How do you think that your religious beliefs affect your life? I think that religion is different based on your personality. My personality is always asking questions such as “where did I come from ?”, “why the world is not treated equally?”, it bothers me a lot. My family in Korea was not rich but I have no memories or experiences in which money was a big issue. Everything was in my hands, whatever I had wanted, in other words I’m not that greedy and not much I wanted because we are not rich. I never felt any shortages financially . However later we had financial crises two times. The first time the store caught on fire and the second time is when my husband broke up with his partnership with his friend in business. However, I never experienced financial crisis until that moment. It was already early 40 for my age and the first time I thought about it. When I was in first or second grade, the pastor came over and my mom and pastor came out from the living room to the garden, my mom gave him something, I knew it was money. Then pastor in Korea was not that financially stable. I wondered why my mom gave money to him, is it not better that money goes in the offer, my mother was a Christian so I grew up in church and learned about ethics, but because that kind of question, my husband became baptized and married me and went to church. For the time of the financial crisis it was suffering and I could not spend enough time with my children, and I wanted to do something else besides making money. I just need basic housing. Three meals a day? I can make it two. We also thought about bible and church and religion. Though my husband and I are two totally different people personality wise, our Christian beliefs connect us and make us one and make us closer in our relationship. 10 SECTION FIVE (25 points) What aspects of the interview did you find to be particularly meaningful? There are many aspects of Sarah Park we find to be touching and interesting. The first thing is that Sarah Park helped us to know how a mundane Asian woman can have such strength and determination for her family. Sarah Park’s father was a banker, therefore, even though Sarah Park’s origin family was not incredibly rich, she grew up from a middle upper class family in Korea. Moreover, Sarah never had a memory of lacking money in her original family of the past, and she went to college to pursue her dream, which is an opportunity that is very challenging to acquire in Asian countries back in the 1970s. Growing up in such a family, Sarah Park is not a weak woman or a spoiled one. She tried her best to save money for her family, especially for her two sons. The resilience and resolve from her have been showed from her experience. We also found Sarah Park’s religious belief is very important of defining her. Even though she is occupied by her work, she still tries her best to go to the church as frequently as she can. As a businesswoman, she has so many questions to ask herself, but none of these questions is about money. She wants to know “where did I come from ?”, “why the world is not treated equally?”. Her religious belief makes her care about not only herself or immediate family, but also others and the whole world. Her daily work routine at the cleaners does not stop her being someone that thinking of philosophical questions. Of course that she is not like a famous political figure, but she serves as an epitome of thousands of ordinary Asian women who live in US who are trying their best to support their family and keep their own faith. 11 What aspects were not useful? What more would you like to know? We find the interview as whole is very meaningful, and each question does lead us to somewhere. However, if we have to say, we think her daily work routine is not very useful to our interview. We spent three mins on how she does her work, which is neither interesting nor defines her character. Also, we think the specific information of her sons is not very useful either, such as when did she give births to her two sons and how they spoke Korean. These details are not very useful to the interview. Sarah Park is a very interesting lady but we did not have enough time to talk with her. We want to know more about her personal life. We want to know questions like “Does she have time to hangout with her friends? ””Are they mostly Korean or American? ” Because she is a highly-educated woman, we also want to know how does she think the political environment in Korea compared to in U.S.? We are also curious about does she ever feel depressed or disappointed of doing her current job, for she went to college but ended up with doing some profession that does not require high education. What other in-class presentations did you find particularly useful? Explain The presentations which I (Yawen ), had found useful and interesting were about Eileen Lui and Grace Young. For the first presentation, Eileen Lui is the Founder of “Soyai” which is a social enterprise whose purpose is to help the youths in underdeveloped areas of countries such as Cambodia, Malaysia, Myanmar, etc. She had used to work at Cambodia, and volunteered for children with the disease HIV at orphanages. Many of these children were without hope, because they knew that they were gravely ill, however Eileen Lui gave them hope and happiness by playing with them, talking to them, and simply being with them. In addition, she supported a monastery in Cambodia and financially supported them, however the people in charge of the 12 monastery continuously asked for more and more money. Thus, she had to ask her friends in Malaysia to sponsor a youth center there. In that youth center, she had encouraged teens who were old enough to work stating to them that they were the oldest out of the kids and needed to step and take responsibility financially wise, though Eileen would keep supporting them for a while, she could not do it forever. Moreover, at their request she helped them learn basic English and learn how to use computers. As a result, they had attained jobs such as interior designers and programmers who now could use computers to help them work. Eileen Lui really left a lasting impression on those in need in the Asian countries she had visited and helped, through her social work. She did not have to be as an Asian immigrant to comprehend the hardships people are enduring and suffering through, as a Asian American she wanted to uplift these impoverished people in Cambodia, Malaysia, Myanmar. Though at first, bombarded because of the financial demands of the monastery, she established a permanent youth center mentioned previously to establish a sustainable and permanent way of life for the teens and children there, not simply a temporary way of life receiving her money, however not working or having no way to work. Another presentation which I found useful was Grace Young. She is a cookbook writer who has integrated storytelling and traditional cooking to her books. Grace Young was a Chinese immigrant and learned traditional cooking techniques from her parents. She had visited chefs in China to see how they cook and if she could learn new additional recipes from her native culture. When she was arrived there and was in the Chef’s kitchen, she noticed that he used a different type of sugar from rock sugar for the recipe of pork belly, which consisted of the ingredients of rice wine, soy sauce, cinnamon, ect. Also regarding her personal life, her own shyness was her main obstacle. Her goal was to bring the Western World and the Eastern World together and keep Asian tradition ongoing in the ever changing world. My personal opinion regarding her 13 goal is very positive, and I admire how she is working in her own ways no matter how small to uphold traditional values and gain acceptance from more and more Westerners of all native Chinese dishes through the work of her cookbooks which introduce such dishes to the Canada, America, United Kingdom, etc. Her desire to combine both worlds and be a bridge between them can be compared to Pearl S. Buck, though a smaller scale which involves cultural foods. (1)
• Aracely Jimenez-Hudis and Emily Seiller AAS 307 Final Report May 9 2018 Section I - Interviewee information Amy Hall Vice President, Eileen Fisher April 18, 2018 4:30 p.m. EST Objective: to obtain an oral history from Amy Hall documenting her childhood, collegiate career and professional careers. Section II - Pre-Interview Process After our interview with Charlene Barshefsky fell through, we wanted to research and schedule an interview with Amy Hall as soon as possible. A simple google search of “Amy Hall Eileen Fisher” turned up her LinkedIn profile, which was very helpful in providing a skeletal outline for different possible interview questions. Ms. Hall had all her education and work experience listed and although we were not completely familiar with all the places she has worked, research on these organizations also gave us a good starting point for formulation questions. We broke up our list of questions into four main sections: Early life/childhood, education, early career and current career/reflection. Ms. Hall has worked at Eileen Fisher for the past 25 years so we focused a lot of our questions on the current career/reflection section. Although we came up with interview questions separately, we met prior to the interview itself and divided the questions in half for each of us to ask. Since we were able to conduct our interview over Skype, we thought it would be best if both of us were fully engaged in the conversation rather than have one person ask questions and the other mostly just take notes. Here are our interview questions as they were originally organized: Early Life - Where did you grow up? - Are there any childhood experiences that influenced your career path? - Have you always been interested in sustainability? Education - What was the most valuable lesson you learned at Georgetown University? - Did you have have any influential mentors during your undergraduate career? - What were some of your life or career goals when you graduated from Georgetown? - What prompted you to get your MBA in 2008? Career Early career - Tell us about your time at the Institute for International Education. What was your most challenging project as Manager of Resource Development? Current career - Tell us about your position as Director of Social Consciousness at Eileen Fisher. - Do you think the fashion industry can be a leader in the movement toward sustainable practices? - What projects or innovations that you spearheaded at Eileen Fisher are you most proud of? - How do you think your background in Linguistics has influenced your career, the way you communicate ideas or the way handle certain projects? What advice do you have for people looking to either lead more sustainable lives or enter a career in sustainability? Do you think purchasing power at the level of the individual consumer has a significant impact on creating an atmosphere/culture of sustainability and environmental awareness? Section III - Interview Summary 1. We definitely got complete answers to most of our questions. After a couple minutes went by during the interview we quickly noticed that Ms. Hall had a lot to say about her life and career and she actually ended up touching on a few of our questions unprompted. As a result, we let Ms. Hall lead the flow of the interview for the most part, letting her speak at length and connecting topics to one another. One example that comes to mind is when Ms. Hall was describing how her study of languages in college helped her get to the position she has now at Eileen Fisher. 2. Our interview was a mix of structured and unstructured. As we mentioned in the answer to the previous question, we had set categories of questions but if Ms. Hall began to speak at length about a topic, we let her, even if it was not necessarily in a precise chronological order. 3. Throughout the project, the workload was shared equally. The initial interview inquiry letter was drafted on a shared Google Doc, as were the interview questions and this very report. Even our presentation was divided equally. In the interview itself, our approach was very similar. As previously mentioned, we split up the questions beforehand and each of us asked our fair share of probing questions, some we had planned on asking and other we asked on the spot. We also made sure to not let there be long gaps in the interview. For example, if we were at a stage in the interview where we were asking questions pertaining to particular section of questions, one of us would jump in with either a topic switch or a new follow up question. 4. While Ms. Hall did not refer any outside links or resources, she did encourage us to check out the Eileen Fisher website which has a lot of information about its human rights and environmental sustainability initiatives. Section IV - Interview Transcript EMILY SEILLER (ES): Where did you grow up? AMY HALL (AH): Until seventh grade I grew up in Connecticut and junior high and high school in a suburb of Philadelphia. They were both suburban and in terms of the Connecticut experience my family was the diversity in the town. My father was Chinese and my mother Caucasian and both were born here so being in CT and being Asian in appearance though obviously American in upbringing was an interesting experience. This goes back to the ‘60s and people just looked at us as different and weird and not like them. There was a lot of bullying and ostracising and stuff like that. ARACELY JIMENEZ (AJ): Did that situation change or improve when you moved to the Philadelphia suburb? AH: When we got to Philadelphia we were still very much a minority. There were a handful more, very small number of Asian kids in the schools, maybe fewer than ten. And probably fewer than four African-American kids, it was very white-oriented. How that influenced me though was when I got to college. I always loved languages and so when I applied to college I really wanted to study languages. My primary language at that point, besides English, was Spanish and I thought I would be a Spanish major. But when I got to college and saw how many Spanish majors there were, the intake counselor asked me what other languages would I want to study and I said “Definitely Chinese,” because of my background I’m sort of curious about it. So he said I should write about it in my application and in doing that I ended up actually majoring in Chinese even though I had never studied it before, nor had I ever known anything about it. My point about that is, I think growing up and feeling different from people and wondering what that Chinese thing in my background was all about caused me to study the language and reconnect with my roots. AJ: Were there any experiences in your early life that influenced your interest in sustainability or non-profit work? AH: It’s funny, I don’t even think of myself as working in sustainability because my work covers multiple areas. It’s part environmental sustainability, it’s also human rights and it’s also women and girls. So growing up, partially because I was so bullied, and I was mortally shy, I just always had a lot of compassion for other people who were also left out. I would just automatically gravitate towards them and I would just feel really badly about them and I wanted to help them! So I was thinking about what to do with my life and I said wow, I just want to do something that helps the world, because for myself it had been a tough upbringing. I thought about being a social worker but I didn’t think it quite suited my personality. Nobody told me when I went to college that it’s really hard to get a job with just a language unless you want to be an interpreter or a translator, which was not my thing either. When I got out of college I wasn’t sure what to do. The kind of work I do now didn’t exist back then and I also had no interest in working in business because I was really interested in helping people. So I got a master’s degree in teaching English as a second language and in doing that I discovered that my shyness made it really hard for me to actually do the work. I had trouble being in front of a class for a long time, keeping them entertained. It was a really harsh discovery so I went into the nonprofit world and found a job in Chinatown in New York City. I started as the assistant of the executive director but because I was the only native English speaker on staff, they started asking me to help out with grant requests. When the time came to look for another job, I realized I was acquiring a skill set around fundraising. So the next three jobs I had were working in nonprofit. I worked for Asia Society, I worked for China Institute. I was fundraising, writing grants, doing events and after doing that for nine years that’s when I realized that was also not a great fit for my personality because I didn’t like rejection. Fundraising just didn’t feel satisfying to me, I didn’t feel like I was having the impact I wanted to have, and I think I was too far removed from the actual work of the organizations, I wasn’t out there hands on with people or communities. When I decided to walk away from fundraising I decided just to take any old job for a couple years until I could figure out what to do with myself. By now I was already thirty-two, so I had already had a career. Long story short I ended up getting an administrative assistant job to the CEO of this tiny clothing company that I had never heard of. The reason I chose that was because growing up I used to make all my own clothes. The CEO left the company within six months, they never replaced him. It was a small and growing company so I just started helping out wherever I could. One of the things I was able to do successfully was start responding to organizations who were sending in letter asking for donations of merchandise I said, well I used to write letters like this, I know what to do with those letters, I’ll organize a system. So four years later I was given the title Community Relations Manager, and that to me was the perfect marriage of what I had been doing with this new situation and I was able to suddenly feel like I could have impact. Well, this was Eileen Fisher, and this is now my twenty-fifth year with the company. The year I got the title Community Relations Manager, 1997, Eileen Fisher made a commitment to the people in its supply chain because we were hearing all kinds of news stories about sweatshops and we thought wow, we’re so small nobody would think to include us in those articles, but we sure could’ve been, and we’d better do something about it. They were looking for someone to do something about the people in our supply chain and I got that job and I didn’t apply for it but the reason they looked at me was because of those languages I had studied! They wanted someone who had cross-cultural experience, who had lived in China and I had all of that. AJ: You just mentioned that you lived in China, could you expand on that? AH: When you’re a language major typically you do a study abroad program and at the time I was in school, I went to college in 1979. So where do you go to study Chinese in 1981, this would have been my junior year, the option was either Taiwan, Hong Kong (where they speak Cantonese, not Mandarin), or mainland China had just opened. It had opened to the West in 1977 and they had just started exchange programs in 1980 or 81. My best friend was studying Chinese and she went to Taiwan and I thought well, that’s cheating, you have to go to the real China. So, I went to China. And when I had landed in China, I had already studied Chinese for two years at that point. Nowadays I think they teach it much better but at that time it was a new language to be taught and they hadn’t figured out how to do it efficiently and my two years of Chinese language study included tons of historical articles. I knew five different ways to say invade or invasion because so much of the historical literature was based of military stuff. I also know a lot of folk tales, but I literally did not know how to say “I’m hungry” or “Where’s the bathroom.” We knew no vernacular, we didn’t study any of that. So when I landed in China I was mortified that I actually couldn’t say anything that was useful. I could give you a whole philosophical treatise on something. So I spent the first three months really miserable and then suddenly it just started clicking and my fluency picked up and I made a lot of friends. I felt like a guinea pig, I was one of four Americans segregated in our own dormitory with about twenty-five Japanese students who were mostly businessmen learning for business purposes. It was a very isolating experience, we were watched all the time. I made Chinese friends and the only reason I was able to do that is if I don’t wear any makeup and if I dress a certain way, I can look a hundred percent Chinese. I blended in if I wanted to but it was really risky. At times I was really close to either getting myself in trouble or getting my friends in trouble because they weren’t supposed to mix with Americans. But it was an amazing year, well before the country started to modernize. It was still very communist, everyone was wearing Mao jackets, everything was rationed, there were no modern conveniences at all and we were in Shanghai. It was quite an impactful year and it did make think about going into international relations. I was at Georgetown and got a scholarship when I was finishing up my fourth year of school to study international relations at Taipei University but something happened and I wasn’t able to take advantage of it. ES: Have you been back to China since then? AH: Yes, many times. On a personal level, I did briefly marry a man who was from China, so we went and visited his family once or twice. But on a professional level, I started going back to China with this new role at the company. By then I was in my mid-thirties and it been many years since I graduated from college and my Chinese fluency was really poor. I went back and found a local Chinese language school and took classes to refresh and so I developed our early auditing protocol for our suppliers-- I will say also at the time, and even today, our US based suppliers are mostly Chinese speaking. The owners will speak English but most of the workers don’t speak a lot of English. I had to learn new vocabulary, I had never spoken about working hours, wage documentation, human rights, so I had to learn all that vocabulary. But I do get to travel to China, I don’t know if I go every year, but maybe every other year I go back. Actually I was there last year and I’m going next month. But it’s about once or every two years I go back to visit suppliers. ES: Do you think the fashion industry, and Eileen Fisher, can be a leader in the movement toward sustainable practices? AH: Many people say that we are already but there’s a lot of things that we do that are beyond what the average apparel company does. We our sights set on changing every single fiber we use over to some environmentally low-impact fiber, whether it’s organic or recycled so we’re moving in that direction. We also have very high expectations for the people in our supply chain regarding living wages and worker voice, worker happiness. We work at all levels of our supply chain, we have goals around all our fibers, the chemistry, the carbon, the water. AJ: In the past twenty-five years you’ve worked with Eileen Fisher, can you tell us about a project that you’re most proud of? AH: SO what’s interesting about that question is, this is the reality of this work-- a lot of the things that we’ve done, have failed, and we’ve learned an awful lot from it. An example is, some years back I’d always been frustrated with the fact that our suppliers here in New York City, or any of the US based suppliers, it’s not typical for them to offer health benefits, something we take for granted as employed American citizens. We looked into what it would entail for our suppliers to offer health insurance. We worked with a health insurance provider and we got one of our suppliers to agree to a pilot program whereby we would pay a premium to the supplier for every single piece that they make which would go toward health insurance premiums for their employees. All US suppliers are relatively small, this one at the time had thirty-five or forty workers. Only one third of them signed up for health insurance. We had a representative from the health insurance company come and talk to them, it was all fully translated. The workers, it turns out, were so suspicious. They were used to going to their acupuncturist, or going to the emergency room when they had a real problem. Very few of them wanted to be bothered with any kind of forms they would have to fill out, some kind of referral form if the needed to see a certain kind of doctor. It turns out, one of the reasons they liked not having health insurance was because they could reflect a very low income and get access to government benefits. By giving them health insurance, it raised their income and suddenly they didn’t qualify for some of the benefits like government housing. So after six months all of the people who had been in the program dropped out. We realized we can’t always apply American values to other people’s experiences, whether they’re American, new Americans or in other countries. We always think about that when we go to other countries but we didn’t think about it in terms of the immigrants here. We think if they’ve come here they want the full experience but in fact they didn’t. It showed us we can’t make assumptions about what other people want or need. AJ: Do you think the purchasing power of an individual consumer can have an impact? AH: It totally can. I’m going to be speaking next week at FIT at Fashion Revolution Day, April 24. I think consumers need to exercise their power much more than we do. It’s too easy right now to buy a ten dollar H&M shirt or Forever 21. We all do it, I have two daughters, they shop, they like stuff. It takes more time to go an research and think oh my gosh, I’m tempted by that over there, I’m gonna save my money and invest in this beautiful sweater. I could either buy four over here or one over here and this one is organic and it’s going to last for ten years. That is a behavior change and a mindset change that is really hard to live up to when you’re surrounded on a day-to-day basis with the magazines and ads. However, I can tell you one time we received a single note from a single person saying how disappointed she was that we used angora and how could we do that knowing the conditions that angora rabbits are raised in. And we thought, wow we never really thought about that so our manufacturing leader went to China where the angora had come from and scheduled a tour of some angora rabbit farms. I was sufficiently appalled by the conditions of the rabbits that we dropped angora after that and just one letter from a single customer. For me, that illustrates a power that people can have if they really take the time to learn about the issue and send a note in. I doesn’t mean every single time we get a note from a customer we go and do something, but a lot of times they will wake us up to issues we weren’t aware of. ES: You mentioned you were speaking at FIT, does your company strive to work with fashion students? AH: Sure, we do a lot. Three or four years ago maybe we worked with professional organization called the council of fashion designers of America, the CFDA, and with them we organized a competition that went out to twenty or twenty-five fashion or design schools in the country and we selected three winners. We were looking for three talented designers to come work with us for a year. Well it turned out, completely randomly, that all three we chose came from Parsons. They came and worked with us to create a line of clothing out of the clothing we were now taking back, we take back previously worn Eileen Fisher clothes and we hold on to it and we create new things out of them. Those three design students started this new line for us which we call ‘Renew,’ and it was the beginning of our whole circular initiative. But in addition to that we bring students in as interns, we go to schools and work with classes or speak to them about what we’re doing to inspire them, we provide materials to schools, leftover materials. AJ: How long has Eileen Fisher been recycling clothes? AH: We started in 2009 and we have two stand-alone stores that only sell previously worn Eileen Fisher clothing. We started by taking clothes back and reselling them but we realized that forty to fifty percent of the clothes we take back can’t actually be resold because they’re too damaged. So we keep everything and we sort it, it’s a very manual process, and we make new things out of it. So we might cut the clothing into pieces and sew it into something like a dress, a tunic or something. Or we’ll cut them into small pieces and we have a felting process that makes upholstery quality fabric. Our two stand alone stores that sell Eileen Fisher Renew clothing are in Irvington New York and Seattle. AJ: I want to move back briefly to your time at Georgetown. Did you have any mentors during your undergraduate career? AH: Not as an undergraduate, I was really undirected, that came much later in life for me. AJ: If you could change one thing that you did at Eileen Fisher, what would it be? AH: I’m not sure I can answer that specifically. What I could say is if there’s something I wish I had known how to do, but I didn’t figure this out until at least ten years into my job, I wished somebody had told me that to be successful and really good at this kind of work I do now, it would have been really good to know this. When I think about the kind of work that I do, which is environmental sustainability, human rights primarily, saying that we want to be a certain kind of company, talking with other teams in the company, talking with other businesses outside the company as an influencer, so what does that require? It actually requires very strong organizational development skills, culture change skills, because what you’re actually doing is changing people’s behavior or mindset. SO, we’ll go and speak with the owner of a factory and say, hey Mr. Li, I know you’ve been doing things this way the entire time you’ve been running this factory and maybe your father did it this way, but let me say we now know we need to do this thing differently. And he’s comfortable because he’s making money doing whatever he’s doing and we need to come in and say, ‘this is better because you’re going to help the environment, you’re going to help all these people and your story may get out on the internet, maybe get on our website.’ Convincing them, anybody in our supply chain, anyone in our whole sphere of influence, it can take many conversations, many visits, many pilot projects, trial and error, it can take that something is the right way to go. It usually requires of them additional money, process change, pulling them out of their comfort zone. Knowing how to manage that human behavior change would have been really useful. People are coming out of college with environmental sustainability degrees, human rights degrees, but I don’t think they’re coming out of college really knowing how to work with people because really what this is all about is getting people to shift their way. And maybe that’s what business in general is all about, I’m not sure, but in this work it would be really useful so I think it should be taught in college. AJ: That kind of work is a lot like topics we’ve been studying in class that has to do with social movements, do you consider yourself part of a broader social movement? AH: I do, in certain instances we think of ourselves as activists, we do a lot of policy work, we go to Capitol Hill, someone in my team goes to pipeline protests. We really are creating a new standard for business, we’re trying to reinvent how the business of fashion should be done in this century. How do you do it in a way that not only does less harm, but eventually nourishes the environment, nourishes the planet, leaves people in a better state than when we first arrived. A lot of what we do is work that hasn’t been tried by another company and in that regard I think we’re activists. It’s definitely two steps forward, one back and it’ exhausting but it’s worth it. ES: Do you have any upcoming projects that you’re excited about? AH: There’s so many! Something that we’re talking about right now is how do we get the whole company, even people in facilities, to really embrace all our values and make their decisions through those lenses, so I feel that is the next big thing. The other big thing, I’m not directly involved in this but I’m excited about it, we did a mapping project where we tried to figure out why our carbon footprint was so high. Basically we figured out quickly that our carbon footprint is high because we airship much of our product from China. So obviously, we should not be airshipping but seashipping, why are we airshipping so much? Through the process of designing and developing the product, they end up with not enough time to send it by sea so often they send by air. Where we are right now, there’s a whole bunch of people working in the company to completely shift our internal processes to shorten the development timeline of a product, give our suppliers more time to do what we want them to do. I mentioned earlier that there’s a lot of failure in this work. Some of our suppliers, we’ve been working with them for over twenty years and yet the core issues have not changed a whole lot. Workers still get paid pretty low wages, hours are still really high, why is that, why can’t we nudge them forward? We figured that because we don’t actually give them enough time to get the product done because we’re putting too much pressure on them. We place the order, we change the order, we update the order, we placed the order for a hundred, now we want two hundred and we still need it delivered on this date. So they run out of time and they airship it, and they don’t want to tell us that they had a lot of overtime and they don’t want to tell us that they weren’t able to pay a higher wage because we’re still paying them the same original amount that we agreed upon. We realized that the suppliers were not able to do their work ethically because of what we’re doing. So we have this whole project to shift our internal process to alleviate the stress on the suppliers and ultimately lead to higher well-being for the workers. So we’ll see, it’ll be another year or so before we see if the intend result happens. But it’s really exciting, this kind of work doesn’t happen at other companies. Section V - Interview Analysis The interview in its entirety was both meaningful and enlightening— it is not often you are given the opportunity to speak to someone with so much life experience who continues to make changes in the world daily. It was very wonderful that she had given us the chance and time to hold the interview, and Amy Hall was incredibly insightful and enthusiastic to the very end. I would say, however, that the most meaningful topic occurred during her talk of getting healthcare to those who work in the supply factories here in America and elsewhere, and the shock of realizing that most, if not all, did not want to partake in the healthcare program and would rather keep to their own customs and cultures— we cannot force American values onto others, even those who live here, and even if one believes what they are doing is for the greater good, it may not be that way towards those they wish to aid towards a more fulfilling life. I do not believe any aspects of the interview were necessarily not useful, any bit of information on her life and the story she had to tell came off as necessary and important. I think there would’ve been tons more to talk about if we had really gotten into the ins and outs of Eileen Fisher, her past careers, and even her recent trips to China which we didn’t really dissect in their entirety due to time constraints. All of the in class presentations were interesting and useful in their own ways— the careers of the women interviewed ranged through classes, cultures and societies. And it was enriching to hear all the stories told. Personally, I found the interview of the laundry owner the most fascinating, perhaps because it was significantly different than the others in that way. It was eye opening and gave us an insight into the life of someone often overlooked and regarded as insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Her life truly spoke to the idea of soft roles. She wasn’t a powerful politician, an author, a diplomat, a lawyer, a ceo. Her connection to her culture felt true and wonderful, and everything that was presented to the class was genuine. (1)
• Benjamin Tucker Professor Christoff AAS/POL 307 5 May 2018 Final Report Section One Person Interviewed: Roberta Lipson Title or Position: Chairwoman of United Family Healthcare Date, time and length of interview: April 23, 2018, 9:08 PM, 37:34 minutes Objective: To obtain a full life’s history of the interviewee, with a particular focus on the interviewee’s career. We sought to learn how gain insight into Roberta’s companies, as well as her own personal contributions to relations between Asia and the United States. Section Two Our pre-interview research consisted of a Google search which led us to 3 past interviews conducted with Roberta (The Beijinger, SupChina, and CityWeekend). These interviews were read and analyzed to garner any information pertinent to our project. A filmed interview conducted by CCTV was also watched not only to obtain more information, but to gain a feel for how Roberta spoke and responded to questioning. We also found information listed on Roberta’s LinkedIn, as well as a page of information regarding Roberta’s professional statistics on Bloomberg’s website such as age (62), location of corporate headquarters (Bethesda, Maryland), educational history (Brandeis and Columbia), and titles and board memberships. We created a list of potential questions for Roberta, making sure not to ask too many questions that she had previously answered in other interviews. This list was sent via email to Roberta’s assistant for review. Questions for Roberta: Early Life: 1. When and where were you born? 2. What were your family’s dynamics growing up? Continued Education: 3. How difficult was learning Mandarin/Cantonese as an adult, while simultaneously earning your MBA at Columbia? 4. What was the ratio of men to women in your MBA program? Did notice any discrimination based on your sex or gender while earning your degree? 5. Were you single when you moved China? [Conditional] Did you feel any trepidation moving to a foreign country by yourself (having to live alone/ speak a secondary language)? What was your living situation like before meeting Elyse Beth Silverberg? Challenges in China: 6. Why did the Chinese government initially give the idea of United Family a “poor reception” when you began discussing its inception during the early 90’s (SupChina, 2017)? 7. You’ve said in the past that the only folks who have access to United Family Hospitals are those “who have money and really good private insurance”. How can the Chinese government incentivize talented physicians to choose employment as family practitioners and clinicians in the healthcare tiers normally reserved for the impoverished (SupChina, 2017)? 8. Why is it so difficult to provide adequate modern medicine through a non for profit system? 9. Does United Family Healthcare have any plans to provide services, perhaps through rural clinics, to the less wealthy people of China? 10. Do Chinese government officials still consider healthcare one of their obligations to the people, or has the for profit system become normalized? 11. Have you faced any discrimination based on your sex or gender while working in China? 12. In what ways has the flow of information between the U.S. and China changed over the past 30 years? I know you had previously mentioned in another interview that when you first began importing ultrasound technology, which had become commonplace in the states, medical practitioners in China hadn’t even heard of the device. Has information exchange improved? 13. Does United Family Healthcare provide services to rural migrants? Reflections on Career: 14. Do you have any regrets in your career? 15. Does the future look promising for the healthcare industry in China? 16. Over the course of your career in China, have you encountered a large number of female CEOs? 17. In your opinion, what is the political relationship dynamic between the United States and China? 18. Do you think your work with Chindex and United Family Healthcare has strengthened relations between the U.S. and China? 19. Do you believe your work as an entrepreneur has affected your personal life in any way? [Conditional] Did you have to give up family life to excel in the workplace? 20. What would you say is your primary goal for the future of Chindex and United Family Healthcare? Where do you see the company and yourself in 10 years? 21. How has the hukou system affected your clients/ patients in terms of being able to receive healthcare? 22. As a woman, what was it like being the primary decision maker during business deals with US exporters. [Conditional] Do you feel that you had to change your behavior being surrounded by men? 23. Do have any personal memories of an individual who has been provided services from one of your hospitals? Section Three 1. I think we obtained complete answers to our questions. Roberta was very forthright and candid. The only question that required coaxing was that concerning Roberta’s behavior while in the company of other executives, who by our understanding of her answer, were almost exclusively men. After some deliberation Roberta provided us with another answer that seemed quite honest. 2. Our interview was a mixed format. Our questions were sent to Roberta prior to our conversation, and although we primarily stuck to those questions, we also deviated at times and spoke adlibbed. The tone of the conversation began formally and became friendlier as it progressed. 3. “Why do you think that is?”- This question was in response to a statement Roberta made after describing the challenges of attracting doctors from the public sector to the for-profit model of healthcare. Her answer, while rich with information, did not address this this specifically and need elaboration. “You said at first that it was difficult to attract talent to China; could you elaborate on that? Besides the language barrier, what are some cultural differences that are apparent?”- This probing question was proposed to have Roberta elaborate on her previous answer. 4. Background research was completed by Ben and Ashley. The list of questions was brainstormed by both Ben and Ashley, and typed out by Ben. Contact between Roberta Lipson’s assistant Melissa before the interview was maintained by both Ashley and Ben in order to establish a date and time of interview, as well as to exchange contact information in case the Skype call was disconnected. The transcript of the interview was written by both Ben and Ashley. This report was written and reviewed by Ben. 5. Roberta referenced us to her LinkedIn which contained articles that described the issue of diversity within her company and within healthcare in general. Section Four Ben & Ashley: Hello Roberta! Roberta: Hello! Ben: How are you? Roberta: I’m doing well. Could you explain to me your project before we begin? Ben: Sure. We are conducting with women from all sorts of walks of life. We were assigned you by our instructor Professor Christoff. Roberta: Oh how nice! Ben: She thought that you would be a very interesting person to talk to seeing as you’ve had firsthand experience working in Asia, and we thought it would be a great pick as well. Ashley: Our class is an Asian studies class on women and relations between the U.S. and Asia. Roberta: Ok, great! Good good good. Ben: Could you tell us a little bit about when and where you were born? Roberta: Sure, I was born in 1955, June, in Brooklyn, New York. Ashley: Oh my goodness! Roberta: I lived there until I was five, and then moved to Long Island until university, living in a very homogeneous environment; probably 98% of my public school classmates were upwardly mobile, Jewish, liberal kind of people. Which, probably, fueled my interest in things that were different at the university. Ben: Yeah, we understand you earned a masters in business administration from Columbia. Roberta: Yeah. Ben: And you studied Mandarin or Cantonese while you were earning that degree? Roberta: So I studied Chinese and Asian history undergraduate. Ben: Oh, ok. Roberta: At university I studied Mandarin Chinese, and then went to Taiwan in my junior year to continue my studies, and then came back and went to graduate school at Columbia University straight out of college. And continued a little bit of my Mandarin studies then, but I had a dual finance and marketing major, but my desire was always to use that degree to get to China and do something in China. Ben: In your class, would you say that you were one of the few women who pursued… Roberta: If I remember correctly there was either 35 women or 35% women but I don’t remember what that was. I’m embarrassed to say, I suspect it was more like 35 women. Which is much better than the ratio that I usually find myself in here now when I’m among my peers. Ben: Oh! That was one of our follow up questions for later on, do you mind if we address that now? Roberta: I got to it in advance. Let’s keep going in your order. Ashley: Did you move to China alone? Roberta: I did. When I got out of business school, I was looking for a job in China but couldn’t find it, because I guess it was too early. So I worked for almost 2 years in a pharmaceutical company in Jersey. I worked and then I got job to go to China and work for an American company that was invited to open an office in Beijing; and yes, I was single. Ashley: Oh, I see. Ben: And you met your husband in China? Roberta: I did, ten years later. Ben: Oh, so in the interim you started Chindex, with Elyse Silverberg. How did you begin that operation, how did that come about? Roberta: Well, she had moved to China more or less at the same time, maybe one month before I did, but she was here studying at Peking University. She came from a similar background that I did; she also grew up on Long Island. She studied Chinese in college at SUNY Albany, and she came here to do her Mandarin studies. And she came around looking for a part time job with our company. So, we hired her, and two years later the company had changed its strategy, and we decided to start Chindex. So we met by chance. And actually a Chinese businessman from Hong Kong met her and she actually had been working part time in the office of China business council, and this Hong Kong businessman had met her and their office was also in the Peking hotel “Hey you ought to meet this other Jewish girl from Long Island on the 16th floor!” And that’s how we met. Ben: Would you say she was instrumental in getting the initial ball rolling in terms of starting United Family Healthcare? Because you’ve said in the past that it was very difficult to be taken seriously. Roberta: At that point it wasn’t so difficult to be taken seriously because we were helping Chinese hospitals to import equipment that they desperately needed from the United States. I would say that it was really helpful to have a partner when we started the company and not to be a hundred percent all alone but at least to have one other person that was in it with you. From that perspective she was quite instrumental in that she was willing to take this leap with me. Ben: I’m happy you had that sort of partnership and that you weren’t completely alone in those first few years. In such a foreign environment that must have been very strange. Roberta: Yeah, it was good to have a comrade. In fact, it wasn’t only the first few years but our partnership lasted in some ways until now. She’s retired from operations but she’s still a director on our board. Not too long after that we took in a partner who also retired recently but remains a director. Ben: In terms of privatized healthcare, do you think the Chinese government is moving towards that becoming the norm, or is public access still the normal… Roberta: Yes, the Chinese government has stated that they want private healthcare to play an increasing supplemental role and they’re trying to implement policies in support of that. Now, if you look at just the sheer number of hospitals in China, about 50% of them are private. However, they have only about 20% of the total bed count, and only about 15% or less of the patients. Ben: So the public hospitals are severely overcrowded? Roberta: They’re overcrowded and they’re dominant, yes. So our healthcare system, United Family Healthcare, operates in a little bit of a niche market. We target 10% of the people who can most afford to make choices in healthcare financially. Ashley: What are some of the challenges in providing modern medicine a nonprofit system? Roberta: Through a non-profit system? We’re actually a for profit company, and I guess we can say our biggest challenge is finding talent. For example, administrative talent, because private healthcare is relatively new in China and most of the experienced managers are those we’ve trained over the years. So there’s not a ready pool of hospital management talent. Because in the Chinese public system, generally surgeons take the role of administrators for a couple of years at a time while they’re still doing surgery. So it's not a completely transferable experience from the public sector to the private modern management sector. So we have to import of our talent, and then we have the challenge of “can those people adjust to China if we’re importing them, or do they have language barriers. So that slowly but surely alleviates itself. Private investment in healthcare has become one of the hottest sectors in China. We have a lot of competition of course; people want to hire the people that we’ve trained. There’s the traditional medical world in China, tradition bias towards private healthcare from the academic side. Although United Family has built a reputation that is probably the most reputable, most trusted brand in healthcare in China, still it's still a big decision from doctors to go from public academia to the private system. Ben: Why do you think that is? Roberta: It’s a really long story. Ben: Ok! [laughter] Roberta: It stems from early, unscrupulous players in private healthcare who started out by attracting people to the STD market, saying “we’re going to cure your sexually transmitted diseases” and charging a lot of money and over-treating and over-testing, playing on people’s fears that didn’t want their STDs to be known by government run hospitals. It started out that private healthcare had a really bad reputation that we had to overcome by doing, really, always ALWAYS doing the right thing. Ben: It seems like, from your previous interviews, that you’ve focused on women’s health in particular. It seems like you’ve had some really good stories about… Roberta: In the beginning, women’s health was the easy fit for Chinese women because the actual patient experience was so bad for women in the public hospitals. I have to take a little break, remember what I just said, I need to read something in the paper very quickly. I’m sorry. Ashley: That’s ok! Ben: It’s totally fine. Thank you for your time. [Pause in the interview, Roberta reads briefing and responds to her assistant in Chinese regarding changes that need to be made to a written statement] [Roberta returns] Ben: Hello! You were just telling us how female healthcare was the easiest to target. Roberta: So, since women were having a terrible, terrible experience in the public system, we were showing a completely different, joyous approach to childbirth. And because childbirth is a set package of services, we could tell them one price. They wouldn’t have to worry that it was going to get more expensive. “This is what it's going to cost”. So it was easier for women to make the decision to have that joyous experience. The first people who came to us were movie stars and people who been abroad and seen other ways of healthcare. They were willing and excited to talk about their experience at United Family, because it wasn’t like they were talking about their broken leg or their cancer or something like that. They were talking about something really joyous. They would go the press and talk about their luxurious experience. After their babies were born they would bring their babies to us for pediatric care as they got older and more and different healthcare needs as they got even older. They would continue to come to us, but because they had talked about their childbirth experience, we kind of became known for that. We started as sort of a primary care, community hospital, but because of that we’ve now grown to be a tertiary care hospital system over many cities providing a full range of healthcare services. But because early on most people talked about the childbirths, most people have this impression that we’re primarily a women’s hospital. Ben: That must have been good publicity, like you said. Roberta: Yeah, it was good publicity, but on the other hand we have over the years suffered because of this idea that we’re a women’s hospital; which has changed to a certain extent. People now know more about what we do. Ben: Do you still import technology through Chindex? Roberta: No. Well, Chindex does, but we sold that medical equipment distribution business to Folsom Pharma three years ago so I’m not really involved in it anymore. But the company continues to do what it’s always done. But we import technology for our own use; for our own hospitals. Ben: You said at first that it was difficult to attract talent to China; could you elaborate on that? Besides the language barrier, what are some cultural differences that are apparent? Roberta: Well, not only attracting outside talent but also asking Chinese doctors who had an iron rice bowl in the public system. Asking them to give up the iron rice bowl and come and work for our little teeny startup new idea situation. And same thing, to ask midcareer doctors in the United States, experienced people, to give up their practice that was maybe successful. Because we only want people who are good and successful to give that up and come across and do this experiment in private healthcare in the world’s largest socialist country was daunting! So it was definitely challenging. Ben: Yeah, I can see that. Are there any changes you would have made during your career in terms of talent you’ve chosen, or hospitals you’ve established? Is there anything you would go back and change at this point? Roberta: Yeah, I mean everybody has things that they could have done better in their career, but generally speaking I’m happy, good. Things are good. Ben: Great, that’s good to hear. Ashley: How would you say that your career has affected your family life? Roberta: Wow. Well first of all I’m very lucky that my parents were supportive and encouraging even though I know they hated having me so far away; including now. My 95 year old mother living in Florida doesn’t love the fact that not I’m living close by, so definitely that’s been hard. But my parents have been amazingly supportive troopers. Oh jeez, I didn’t call her this morning. So I try and call my mom every morning, and it means a lot to her. I just realized, with all that’s happened this morning, I missed the call, which is really bad. Ben: We won’t keep you for much longer if you need to call her. Roberta: It’s too late to call her now anyways so don’t worry about it. I’ve worked really hard and long hours, and I was lucky enough to meet my husband after I got to China. He comes from New Jersey. Not from a completely dissimilar background to mine. It was partly really good luck, and partly, he was Elyse’s first cousin. He still is Elyse’s first cousin. He came to visit her on his way on his bicycle trip; not planning to stay in China at all. But then we met and one thing led to another and he never left. I was lucky enough to have him remind me to take time out to smell the flowers and to connect with my family and friends. That’s been great, we’ve had three sons. It was wonderful being in China in a way, because it’s possible to have very good help with child care here. Basically, there were always three women in our house who were the partners of my husband and myself in raising our children and most of my children, generally, I think they feel that they’re fortunate to have almost 4 mothers, rather than 1, and still are very close to the ladies that helped us through their childhood. They are now all in their early 20s. So being able to have a family, and have a career, and build a company I think is something that may have been harder to do “not” in China or in the US where child care is not that readily available and affordable and acceptable. I honestly wasn't able to spend as much time with my kids growing up as a stay at home mom would have, but I think generally speaking they're proud of me, and considering what I’ve done, to be worthwhile; that their sacrifice of not having me home all the time was something that ended up with a good thing and they appreciate that. Ben: Are they finishing university now? Roberta: No, they’re all out of school. Two of them are in China actually now. One is a musician, and one is an editor for an English language magazine in Guangzhou; editor, reporter, writer. Ben: That’s great! Ashley: That’s amazing! Ben: That’s one of the things we’ve talked about in our class, is positions of soft power and how those can affect U.S. Asian relations. I’m sure he has a unique perspective and is able to share that through that paper. Roberta: Yes, and my husband is a journalist as well. He writes for The Economist magazine. We talk about things like that [inaudible] all the time. They, I think, have found it really interesting growing up in China and mostly appreciate it. I think especially when they look at what's going on in the U.S. we’re all kind of happy not to be there. Ben: It’s very scary. Roberta: It is, it is. It’s also really hard because it used to be possible to be proud of the U.S. and its values and now it’s really embarrassing. Ben: What kind of rhetoric are you guys hearing over there about the states? What’s our image like? Roberta: I think that the Chinese see our leadership as a joke. And they see what's happening in the U.S. and think it's an opportunity for China to take its place on the world stage. They kind of thank Trump for giving them the opportunity to fill the vacuum that we’ve caused. Ben: Do you think they’re up to the task, can fulfill that position well? I know that's a difficult question to answer. Roberta: No, I think they have a strategy where we don’t. Ben: That seems to be the case Roberta: China really has an impressive strategy. You know I'm not making a value judgment good or bad but I think it’s hard to say well intentioned… yeah, certainly as well intentioned as the United States was in trying to rule the world. Ben: Can we shrink the conversation back to healthcare? Roberta: Sure! Whatever you’d like. Ben: What's the corporate culture like there? Is it predominantly men? Roberta: Every culture, as I say whenever I’m outside among my peers, it’s very rare that there's more than 10% women on any panel, or in any sort of government led meeting, or industry led meeting, even though healthcare is more predominantly female than other industries. When you get to leadership peers, women are sadly in the minority. That's something we’re proud of. Our company, I think that all of our numbers, if not a majority women in leadership roles, certainly not less than 50%. We are very proud of that. Ashley: Would you say you had to take a firmer stand or over compensate because you’re a woman in a leadership role? Roberta: Internally? Ashley: Well, to everyone else. To your employees, or to business partners. Roberta: No, no. Certainly internally… We’re a firmer stand… Do you mean tougher? Ashley: Yeah. Roberta: No, no. The question is “tougher than what”? I don't try to compensate for the fact that I’m a women by being a tough guy. I think we have a pretty much a consensusdriven leadership approach in our company and I wouldn't change it so I could look more like a man. Ashley: That’s good. Well what about externally? Roberta: Externally? It’s hard to… Maybe sometimes I feel the need, but not really. I kind of feel like my style is what it is and I’m not sure if I consciously compensate or try to be tough. Every once in a while like anybody in a situation would say “Ok, this calls for being a tough guy and you do it”. Ben: Where do you think your company has played a role in terms of U.S./Asian relations. Do you think that you’ve opened up more diplomacy? Do you think you’ve softened relations? Because I remember growing up we didn't hear anything about China, now there's more and more information coming out but it’s still very regulated. Do you think your company has played a role in that? Roberta: I think that increasing understanding through contact on the grass roots level, you know, on this side in China, showing people a really ethical place to work. We have over two thousand employees and over the years maybe we’ve touched ten thousand people’s lives or more. And patients, certainly hundreds of thousands, millions of people. And to show that coming from an international US originated company, I think has been wonderful. I’m a real believer in grass roots, people to people understanding. Being able to play a good role in keeping peace and harmony in the world. Bringing lots of American technology to China has increased Chinese people's appreciation for the level of technology in the US. Which people still respect, even if they don't respect our leadership. Ben: We don’t either. Roberta: I've always been on the board of either of the American Chambers of Commerce in China, AMCHAM, it’s not the U.S. Chamber, it’s AMCHAM China, or U.S. China Business Council, I’m on the board of directors of that. So that’s always encouraging discussion, every year there delegation which I’ve been on before and I will be on this year again, of U.S. business leaders in China that go back to talk to people in Congress about the relationship and our view from on the ground. We’re talking to Chinese government leaders all the time, so yeah I think we do play a role. Ben: What does the future hold for United Healthcare? Do you have any big plans that you want to announce? Roberta: Yea, well from the beginning, from our first hospital our goal was not only to provide healthcare to as many people as we could, good evidence based healthcare in a respectful environment, but also set an example for different models of healthcare that could be reflected in reforms in the Chinese public system. We feel like by example we have done that. We see some of the things we’ve done echoed in the public system including the focus and investment we’ve made in the importance in primary care. Including proactive preventative health rather than just disease intervention. We see all of that being reflected in Chinese policy and we hope to be able to continue doing that. We’re now involved in an insurance partnership that is kind of like a Kaiser HMO, and we think it’s a really good approach to healthcare, and we hope that we’ll get acceptance and grow and build more places where Chinese people can enjoy the wonderful healthcare that United Family provides. Ben: Very well said. Do you have any more questions Ashley? Ashley: She’s pretty much answered all of mine. Roberta: Let me just say one thing. Ben: Yeah, of course! Roberta: So, I understand this is more of like a women’s role in the relationship kind of thing. So, I have some articles on Linkedin that are relevant on diversity. So if you check my Linkedin I think there are some things that are relevant on how we do diversity in our company and the importance of diversity in healthcare. So, I would recommend you have a look there. Ben: We’ll check it out. Thank you very much. Ashley: Thank you so much. Roberta: You’re very welcome. Good luck. Ben: Thank you for the interview! Roberta: Will you share what you write? I don’t need the transcript but I’ll be interested in the product, what you end up writing. Ben: I’ll make sure you get a copy. Roberta: Ok, very good. Thank you! Ben: Thank you for talking to us! Ashley: Thank you for the interview! It seems that Roberta has created a company in which there is equal opportunities for women, both in direct care and administration. Roberta did mention that outside of her own company, and within China, the great majority of CEOs are male; as is the trend in the rest of the world. I think that future interviews should focus on the policies of United Family Healthcare concerning diversity and equality and how those policies might be implemented in other industries; not only in China but in other countries as well. Section Five I found Roberta’s life story incredibly inspirational. Roberta’s initiative and ability to seize the opportunities presented before her allowed her to capitalize on China’s burgeoning private business sector. It was excellent to hear that Roberta did not compensate or compromise her identity as a female in order to succeed in China’s private industries. It was not particularly useful to hear about the publicity United Family Healthcare received during its first years, as this was not pertinent to our research. I would like to learn more about the challenges faced by China’s public healthcare system under hukou policy, as those questions were not addressed during our interview. I found similarities between ours and Beyza and Stephanie’s presentation. Both of our groups faced problems when established a Skype connection, as both of our interviewees’ had privacy blocks placed on their internet access by their respective governments; Roberta’s by the Chinese government and Economy’s by the U.S. government. It was clear from our interview that we can learn quite a lot here in the United States by observing and analyzing what is happening right now in China’s private business sector. Roberta Lipson’s career showcases the relative lack of gender discrimination taking place within China. Roberta’s dedication to learning the language of Mandarin has allowed her to integrate herself in Chinese culture on a level that is inaccessible to non-Mandarin speakers. In this way Roberta has subscribed to one of the tenants of the Art of Social Change as described by Kwame Anthony Appiah. (1)
• Biography Rosemarie Barnett is an Immigration Rights Attorney based in New York, she was born and raised in an affluent family of 7 (3rd sister) in India and she has also spent time living in Taiwan. Her family encountered financial difficulties after the death of her father when she was 10 years old. After his death her mother made an emphasis on investing in an education rather than dowries (which was more typical in India), and was sent to an exclusive boarding school. She later attended a small liberal arts college in Massachusetts through a scholarship, and out of practicality she decided to obtain a Bachelors in Business, but her true dream was to become an Engineer (she was not able to pursue this due to finances and her school). Upon graduating she went on to her MBA, and took a class related to law which sparked her interest in pursuing a career in law. She met her husband while earning her MBA and has had 3 children between earning her MBA and law degree. Since earning her law degree she has worked at an elite law firm for 12-13 years and has since opened up her own practice. Main points/relation to Asian American Women Rosemarie has emphasized the importance of personal happiness and how ultimately life is a self-fulfilling prophecy. She talked to us about the many incidences she has faced due to the fact that she was an Asian American woman from being harrassed on a bus in India as well as being told by a hiring manager that she needs to be taking care of her children, despite being qualified for the position. In Order to overcome these barriers she emphasized that women need to become more assertive and appeal to others about their capabilities and to borrow from the “men’s playbook” 1) 2) Reinforced things we learned in class - Mention relation to Missing 33% video a) One of the questions we asked her was what is some advice you can give to women who want progress and get ahead in their career, and how different is this process in comparison to men. Video we watched in one of the lectures called the b) “Missing 33%”, or why women could not become as successful in their careers in comparison to men. It was revealed that often times mentors would try to build the confidence of women, while they spent time teaching the actual business to men. Because of this difference in mentoring, the gap between men and women was developed. Provided new information - Advice for young people finding their careers - Focus on trying to drown out negative voices, think about what you like to do. The bright side of living in this generation is that there are way more opportunities and options. In her generation the goal was working for a large company with great benefits. She mentioned internet business, bloggers and things that are unconventional, embrace the freedom and the opportunities that are available now. Introduce clip: a) How do you progress in your career/get ahead (as a woman) in India or the U.S.? i) Are the rules of “progressing” up the ladder different for men and women? Step 1: Pre-Interview Research ● Once Professor Christoff told us which prominent Asian-American woman we’d be researching, we started with a Google search on Rosemarie, which led us to her LinkedIn profile and her professional website. Her LinkedIn provided us with background information like where she attended school, and her previous jobs at large law firms, which is where she started out. Her website led us to more up-to-date information on her current law firm that she runs, and the various cases that she has covered in the short five years since opening her own firm. Step 2: Preparing Questions ● Once we had a rough basis of Rosemarie’s life and work, we drafted questions that would give us more insight on her life growing up in India because the Internet did not tell us much about that, as well as some thought-provoking career-related questions like things the things she did to jump start her career and what kind of difficulties she has faced along the way because she is an Asian American woman. Step 3: The Interview ● We were very fortunate that the person we were interviewing was a great speaker. Whenever we would ask a question, even something basic like “Where did you attend school in India?” she would often go on personal anecdotes and give us even more insight than we had asked for, which was very helpful. She told us a lot about gender biases in India, and the challenges women face in today’s society to be taken seriously or just as seriously as their male counterparts. An example of a time where we used active listening was when she told us the story of how she came to be a lawyer, and we referenced parts of that story when asking a follow-up question on what she would have done differently on her path to success. In regards to verbal cues, the only noticeable changes in her tone was when she talked about her father’s death and the impact it had on her family (which is understandable because it’s obviously a heavy topic). Her body language throughout the interview was very relaxed, she kind of spoke to us like we were her kids asking for advice (because her kids are around our age) and because she was comfortable, we were also comfortable throughout the conversation. (1)
• Experiences as a women – considered as more emotional, just wanted to go against the harsh system NGOs – certain issues they can and can’t touch. Not all the money is going to the people. Wrote to UNICEF about how the govt was holding student documents and students weren’t allowed to go to school because of missing documents, but UNICEF didn’t answer her letter. Hopes for the future – mentality change. Everything happens in a cycle, so it will take a few generations to start on a clean slate but women should do as they see fit, whatever needs to be done (clean or work, etc) 1 2 (1)
• Flora Ho and Aashishpal Singh Final Paper Section 1 Person Interviewed: Sarah-Ann Smith Interviewee’s Title/Position: Ex-Foreign Service Officer in U.S. State Department, Author of Trang Sen, Public Speaker and Ex-Professor at the University of North Carolina Date, Time and Length of Interview: April 23rd 2018 at 4:00PM. The duration of the interview was approximately 52 minutes. Our objective in conducting this interview: Our objective was to learn more about Ms. Smith and her multitude of experiences throughout her career. We focused a lot on her work as a foreign service officer because at the time she served as one, it was extremely rare for a woman to obtain that job and title. Since her mission with the State Department was based mostly in Asian countries, we hoped that she could share with us her experience being a woman link between Asia and the United States. Section 2 Background information about Ms. Sarah-Ann Smith could only be found with detailed searches. Sarah-Ann Smith was a common name, therefore we added her book name, Trang Sen, and she was immediately found on Pisgah Press, which is known for their publications of books that provide insight into human conditions and the world around us. She was also found on LinkedIn, where we were able to get some educational and professional background on her. We became well aware of her tenure as a foreign officer for the U.S State Department and the great deal of time she spent at the American University studying International Affairs. The real introduction to Sarah-Ann Smith began when we were connected through Professor Christoff. She immediately provided us with a copy of Ms. Smith’s most popular book, Trang Sen, and we contacted her through email. Ms. Smith provided quick responses and was very helpful. She provided us with her bio form from a previous interview, which gave us a broad overview of her most notable experiences and accomplishments. The bio went into detail about her duties in the state department, especially in Hong Kong, and her role in the triangular relationships held between China, Taiwan, and the U.S after the Vietnam war. Her exposure to the war had a big impact on her career, which actually inspired her book. She also speaks Mandarin and worked as a professor in the U.S, China, and Southeast Asia. Reading Trang Sen really gave insight on Ms. Smith’s view of life and her profession. The concepts of harmony between countries and understanding of each other’s culture are prevalent in her writing. This is mirrored through her work in foreign service and her international missions with the Presbyterian church. She saw herself as a bridge between the U.S and China. Through this background search, we learned so much useful information about Ms. Smith which allowed us to formulate the most appropriate questions for her. We wanted to learn what inspired her to get involved in foreign relations and what it was like being a woman in such a male dominated field. These were the questions we asked in our interview:       Tell us about growing up in South Carolina. Do you think that going to an all-women’s college influenced you to want to begin a career in international affairs since at that time, it was not encouraged for women to go into that field? What caused you to focus on Asian countries in particular? o What was it about these Asian men that really influenced you? What experiences did they share that really stuck with you? (Active listening - Probing) How did you begin your career in foreign affairs specifically within the US government? Was there any battle between getting involved in foreign policy vs. your faith in the religion, or do you think this went hand in hand? (Active listening) Do you think that while you were working in the embassies of other countries, you were treated differently because you were a woman?   o So that invitation for tea that the general gave you. Do you think he would have given that invitation to a male officer? (Active listening – Probing) Do you think that the governments of other countries [Japan and Hong Kong] incorporate more women into their governments and embassies? Did you have some underlying goal in telling the story of Trang Sen? Section 3 Sarah-Ann Smith was a seasoned interviewee – it was clear that we were not her first interviewers. She was comfortable with anything we asked and provided detailed responses filled with interesting and useful information. We did our best to create a comfortable environment where Ms. Smith could speak as freely as she liked. Most of our questions were open-ended, allowing Ms. Smith to basically tell a story for each of her answers. This gave light to aspects in her life which weren’t covered in our list of questions. For example, our opening question simply asked what it was like to grow up in South Carolina. Her response gave us insight on her ideology which was influenced by a very “conservative and racist” area since the South was in mayhem during the time of the Civil Rights Movement. She explained how her upbringing is what influenced her to become involved in the Christian church. We had no prior knowledge of her faith in Christianity, however, we learned that her involvement in the church is what inspired her career in international affairs. We gained a lot of information by asking “why” and “how” questions to understand Ms. Smith’s reasons for her choices and how they influenced her career. We planned a structured interview for Ms. Smith, however, the open-ended questions created a more unstructured environment where we began probing to stimulate conversation on an unexpected topic, which she passively mentioned in her answer. For example, her unexpected mention of her devotion to the Christian faith reminded us of missionary women throughout history who saw Christianity as a means to spread Western influence and “save” people throughout Asia. We asked her to expand and it was nice to hear that her mission was not about saving or transforming anyone, but rather to get people with differences to understand one another. We worked very well as a team. We were both on the email chain with Ms. Smith and worked separately and together on our pre-interview research. We were responsible for coming up with our own list of questions, from which we collectively picked out the best ten. Something that was very beneficial was reading Trang Sen before our interview. The book was relatively short and provided great insight on Ms. Smith’s views of the Vietnam War and ideology in life. It also helped us understand specific scenes Ms. Smith referred to in our conversation. Since we conducted our interview though the phone, and not video chat, we found it would be best for one person to do a bulk of the talking so that Ms. Smith could get comfortable with answering to one person. Flora handled this role and was great at probing for further explanations, allowing Aash to speak when he thought of something interesting. However, we both stayed active in the conversation to ensure her we are on the same page. Section 4 Interview Write Up (concisely) Sarah-Ann Smith grew up in Columbia, South Carolina in the 1940s and was surrounded by a “very conservative and racist world.” It was when Smith started working in Richmond, Virginia and attended a sit-in movement when she realized how wrong she grew up; this motivated her to begin to try and teach herself to think a different way. She gave us a little lesson about United States history to explain what she meant by these statements in case one got the wrong impression or interpretation. She explained that the South had been majority Democrat in the 1940s-1950s and later became Republican after the Civil Rights Movements in the 1960s. Therefore, the environment in the South was somewhat “racist” because of their Republican/conservative views during that difficult time. Smith attended a small all-women’s college in Charlotte, North Carolina. However, international relations had not always been the field of work that Smith intended to be involved with because she actually already had a career as a director of Christian education in a Church. In 1965, Smith moved to New York to work for the Presbyterian International Mission and Relations Commission during the Vietnam war and surprisingly, this is what caused Smith to be interested in international affairs. There, she met many intelligent young men from Asia who were students brought to America on scholarship by the Presbyterian Church that impressed Smith and after speaking with them, she learned how different their perspective was on U.S. policy was than those of Americans. This caused her to want to be more open towards other people’s points of views on American policies. This resonated with us because we learned in class this semester about the stark differences that Asian-Americans and other minorities faced growing up in America as opposed to White-Americans because they needed to learn how to assimilate into mainstream American culture while still being exposed to their native Asian cultures at home. We learned about how important these differences are when examining how a person grew up and the kind of impact it continues to have on him/her as an adult. In addition, many people in our class agreed that people from other countries often believed that Americans had a superiority complex that caused them to try and impose their superiority onto other nations which may have become clear to Smith at this time. After quitting her job in New York, Smith returned to school to obtain a master’s degree in international studies at American University in Washington. She had originally planned to do some work relating to international affairs education through some Church or non-profit organization, but she soon became interested in foreign policy within the United States government. She took various exams for the government, including the foreign service exam and was later asked to join the foreign service with the class of 1973, which she, of course, accepted. At this time, she was only the fifth woman in the State Department’s history to to become a Chinese language officer and thus, she faced an enormous amount of discrimination during her time there. She even informed us that the reason she did not pursue a full 20-year career in the State Department, like most officers do, is because of how hard it was to be a woman diplomat at that time. To our surprise, Smith did not have a hard time relating to the Chinese or people of other embassies as a woman, but faced the most discrimination from her own American colleagues. One example Smith shared with us was when she was told that she needed to attend the tea [party] that the general’s wife had for all of the wives of the officers. Another highly inappropriate example of the discrimination that she felt was when she was the only officer to not be invited to a stag dinner for a Japanese diplomat who was actually a friend of hers. In regards to how she thinks the world is now on incorporating more women into their governments and embassies, Smith feels that “it’s a mixed bag but it’s not good. It won’t be good until its fifty percent-fifty percent.” She also believes there is still also a long way to go for us in the United States because we haven’t even had a woman president yet, like many other countries have! Although Smith went on to explain that she has long parted from her Church connections and now identifies mostly with Chinese Daoism, her experience with the commission still greatly impacted her career. The mission that she worked with was not like a typical American women’s mission where they went to other countries in hopes to save “the heathen” there and cleanse them with Christianity. This touched upon a theme that we learned in class in which many commissions believed they were doing something for the people of other countries instead of trying to accomplish missions with those people. This may be due to the superior complex of Americans that we touched upon earlier. Instead, her mission had an open concept and philosophy; it understood that they needed to be in dialogue with not only indigenous churches in various countries around the world, but also with various faiths. This was similar to the ideals of Reischauer, who believed that missions in countries abroad, such as his in Japan, needed to be approached through assimilation to really understand them, and not criticism; he never saw himself as superior to the Japanese. This open mindset helped Smith during her work as a foreign officer by giving her the ability to stay neutral in times of conflict. For example, during her service, Smith worked a lot on the triangular relationship of Taiwan, China and the United States during the Taiwanese opposition movement. She felt that she had a better understanding of Taiwan than most Chinese foreign officers because of her experience with the commission since she was able to be more neutral, not pro-China nor pro-Taiwan, but to see Taiwan as an entity that is important on their own. She believed that the people of Taiwan had the right to their own space and political system (during a time when Taiwan was under the control of China). This triangular relationship of China, Taiwan and the United States, in which the United States stood as a guarantor of Taiwan to guarantee [to the UN and China] that they were only using nuclear energy for peaceful purposes, seemed to be very important to Smith and her career because even after she left the State Department, she conducted several studies on the Taiwan opposition movement for the State Department since she knew how little the government paid attention to it. She even went around the United States interviewing leaders and asking them questions on what they thought they were doing. Clearly, Smith had an influential role in the relationship between the United States and China but she did not have much experience with women specifically in this role and thus, her work actually did not involve “women’s work for women” much. She had made many connections with women in the consulates of other countries such as Hong Kong, China, Taiwan and Iran, but she did not do any hands on work like report on women’s issues to the State Department or anything on that official channel. However, she did share with us that she often interviewed women who were active in the women’s movement, such as Diane Ying, who is the publisher of a Chinese newspaper and would have discussions with other Chinese women in power about women’s roles in the United States and China. Smith is also unmarried and does not have children so she was not subject to the ideals of “manifest domesticity” or the typical roles bestowed upon women by society, allowing her to be focused on her successful career. In our interview with Smith, she also shared the way that she came up with the idea of writing her book, Trang Sen. Surprisingly, she had not even been to Vietnam yet when she first got the idea. She was parked outside of a movie theatre in northern Virginia where she was watching dozens of Vietnamese immigrants wandering back and forth through a small shopping area when she decided she would write a novel about a Vietnamese girl who immigrated to America. She made it clear that she wanted to write it from the girl’s viewpoint and not from an American’s standpoint, exemplifying her understanding of other cultures. Smith’s style of writing is intuitive, and she often knows a general idea of what’s going to happen but none of the details along the way. Something interesting is that after she has come up with a scene or a series of scenes, she reads an anthropology book about the location of the scene, such as ‘village life in Vietnam’, and modify what she had wrote in order to be more accurate. Although she had never intended for Trang Sen to become a historical novel, she has found that it has come to be one after meeting with multiple book groups. She said that “once you write them, it is up to the readers to determine what they are.” Lastly, Smith shared with us that her goal in her life is to help people better understand each other. This mostly involved trying to broaden Americans’ understanding of the rest of the world and the “others” in our own society. In her work as a diplomat, she saw her goal as serving as a bridge between the United States and China, by both explaining U.S. policy to others abroad and adding depth to her own colleagues’ understandings as well. Even now when Smith works as a public speaker and teacher, she continues to add to Americans’ knowledge of parts of the world where the U.S. is deeply involved. We think that our interview went very smoothly. Sarah-Ann has accomplished so much in her life and career that it was difficult to really ask all of the questions that we had for her with the amount of time we had set for our interview. We were so fascinated with her work abroad and as a foreign agent that we did not have much time to discuss her book and how it has influenced her since that is what she is most involved with in her work today. Sarah-Ann is just as brilliant as the women that we wrote about in our midterm papers, except we had the opportunity to actually speak with her and discuss her role in U.S.-Asian relations. We were lucky that she was so open with us and wasn’t hesitant to share personal stories from her life. Section 5 Sarah-Anne Smith has such a wonderful story and we have learned meaningful lessons through her experience. For example, Ms. Smith made it clear that she had no idea her career would take the path that it did since she originally wanted to work with the Church and not foreign affairs. She provided solace in letting us know that careers are filled with unexpected realizations and opportunities. She had become unexpectedly drawn to foreign policy while getting her masters at the American University, leading her to take various tests to work for the U.S government. She went on attempting to get her PhD when we was asked to join the foreign service and her whole career trajectory changed. She went on to tell us about the discrimination she faced as a woman foreign service officer. It was such a surprise to learn that a majority of the sexism came from within her own department when we expected the U.S to be tolerant while foreign countries might take women less seriously. Yet, Ms. Smith states that the gender inequality prevented her from pursuing a permanent career in in foreign service. We did not find that Sarah-Ann said anything that was not useful to us in our interview. She made sure that everything she said had substance and related to the question. Even if she got off topic, it would lead us to a new fascination for us to ask about, not a roadblock. She would tell us about points in history that were important to her work and if we did not know much about it, she would explain it thoroughly to us and this would actually help us understand her life better. She stated mostly facts about her life and told us stories while trying to give as little of her personal opinions as possible. We do wish we could have learned more about her personal ideologies and views, but did not want to pry on aspects that she preferred to keep private. The thing about interviewing successful people is that we had to be careful of taking up too much time. Ms. Smith had so many interesting information to share with us that we didn’t get through every question we wanted to ask. We were prepared to speak more about Tran Sen, however, the information about her career and why she got into foreign service gave us more insight into her ideology and way of life. We also wanted to ask her about her personal life – family, friends, influences, and what she was up to now. A few of the in-class presentations really stood out to us and some that presented before us ended up being very useful when we were designing our own PowerPoint. One pair spoke about their interviewee, Eileen Lui, so highly because they were actually friends with her and that stuck out to us because they truly wanted to spread her message and work. We realized that we needed to exhibit this same enthusiasm in our presentation as well. Another presentation was that of Rosemarie Barnett since she is an attorney in New York and we both want to be lawyers. Her advice to women about having to “borrow from the men’s playbook” was interesting; she feels that women often need to know how to brag about themselves like men do and it is not enough just to get the work done well anymore. We regretted that we did not ask Sarah-Ann about any advice that she would have for women hoping to enter the foreign service field; perhaps this is something we would like to ask in a follow-up interview. We also recall a presentation in class about a Chinese woman who owns a Laundromat and this pair stood out to us because they had actually gone to the interviewee’s place of work. We believe that they were the only pair to have interviewed their interviewee in person and was able to see firsthand what they have accomplished. We wish that we could have done the same with Sarah-Ann if she lived in New York. (1)
• Image Source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/monicawang/2016/07/25/from-goldmansachs-to-nonprofit-nancy-yao-maasbach-and-the-museum-of-chinese-inamerica/#3150960b1c2d What is your interviewee’s mission or goals in life and how is she/he fulfilling this? How does her/his mission or goals relate to women’s roles in US-Asian relations? What did you learn from the interviewee that 1) reinforced things we learned in class and 2) provided new information? - Nancy Yao Maasbach is the president of Museum of Chinese in America (MOCA) and her goals in life is to bridge the gap between Chinese Americans and Americans by providing the platform for individuals who struggles with fitting into his/her communities to explore their imaginations. Nancy struggled with expressing herself as she felt confined by social norms and expectations to do certain things in certain ways. Nancy shared with us her immense passion for theater, in which she was a theater minor when she attended Occidental College. - Nancy had spent all her “hong bao” money from Chinese new year on Yale’s application fee for their theater program, but only to be turned away with a rejection letter. She thought she wasn’t good enough. Luckily, Nancy was able to redeem herself through other areas of work when she received her masters in business administration and gained a job as an investment banker overseas at Goldman Sachs in Hong Kong. Recruiters thought Nancy, ‘China hire’ where people expected her to have connections with the China market. She struggled for a long time to redeem herself through hard work to show that even though she was not a China hire, she was still capable for the job. It was this job that challenged her to work to her full potential and eventually come to the realization that she wanted to help others who struggle with expressing themselves like her. - Nancy’s role as the president opened up doors for her to help those who struggle with being confined to certain ideas and stand for themselves. Programs at the museum allow people in the community to better understand the historical background of the Chinese communities in America and some of the struggles they faced. Nancy’s goals relates to women’s roles in US-Asian relations because Nancy was able to overcome the barriers that confined her thoughts and constantly trying to improve her role as a woman, which can really motivate other women in U.S-Asian Relations to follow the same path. Even though she still struggle with how to be a good mother, good wife, and good daughter, Nancy allowed us to see what it takes to be a woman in her position. Nancy shared similar goals as many other women we have learned about from our class, which is to take actions on matters that we value on. Just like the missionary women who went oversea to spread Christianity, Nancy was able to raise awareness in understanding one’s culture or identity before confining them to a certain specific norms. We were able to learn the importance of self-exploration and perseverance from Nancy. She allowed us to realize how important it is to speak up for ourselves and go with our intuitions when we are pursuing our interests. The process is what matters the most because what we learn from the process will be major factors that determine what we would like to do in the future in life. How did the questions you asked your interviewee influence the type of information you received? If working in a team, explain your approach and provide an example of your active listening. Also, what were some of the verbal and non-verbal cues? Refer to the “How to Conduct an Interview” discussed in class. We asked Miss Nancy a variety of questions ranging from her ethnicity, childhood growing up in Flushing, Queens, her college and work experiences, and about her current position as the president of Museum of Chinese in America. The questions that my partner, Melissa, and I asked definitely influenced the type of information we received. For instance, in this one minute video, we ask Miss Nancy about her work experience in Hong Kong after leaving Goldman Sachs, and the challenges she encountered while making the transition. When questioning about her experiences, Miss Nancy answers saying that while living abroad, “you have a lot more time by yourself...to observe and process” things. After discussing about the “alone time” that Miss Nancy had while working in Hong Kong, Miss Nancy connected it back to her time working in Goldman Sachs where she felt like she had to “prove” herself. Moreover, she wished that she was more mature at the time. This response influenced the course of our interview and the follow up questions that we asked after. Before interviewing Miss Nancy, Melissa and I (Tenzin) had decided to equally split the questions that we were going to ask. Thus, Melissa asked the first 8 questions and I asked the remaining 7 questions on our list. Miss Nancy was able to provide answers to questions that were asked, and also gave additional information which answered some of our other questions. This prompted us to actively listen and formulate new follow-up questions on the spot. These follow-up questions enabled us to move our conversation forward, and Melissa and I were both able to add our remarks in between conversations to avoid any awkward silence. While talking to Miss Nancy, her tone helped give meaning to her spoken message. When discussing about her childhood experiences growing up in Flushing, Queens she sounded very enthusiastic and happy to reminisce and talk about her past. This cue was expressed in a “Rate” way. However she also expressed her regrets and sorrow while in Hunter high school. She felt mediocre and not at the same level as the other kids because of her test scores and her GPA. During this conversation, we could tell that her tone and pitch of her voice was decreasing. We could also tell that her high school experience was not as great as she hoped it would be, which became increasingly evident through her facial expressions, eye behavior, and posture. Her face looked more serious, eyes were down, and her posture was not as straight. These were a few among many of the verbal and nonverbal cues we captured. Overall, this approach proved to be very effective and we were able to have a very interesting and enriching interview with Miss Nancy. The Interview lasted for an hour and 3 minutes. (1)
• Isabela Kernin and Bryanna Mojica AAS 307/POL 340 Women in US-Asian Relations Final Interview Project: Gloria S. Chan Section 1: Introduction For our final project we interviewed Gloria S. Chan, a second generation Asian American who currently works as a professional development coach. The interview was conducted over phone on April 27th at 12pm and lasted a little over an hour. Our objective in conducting in the interview was to learn about her life and her motivations for becoming a coach, as well as her motivation for previously being a leader in Asian American advocacy. We wanted to compare her experiences to what we learned in class about the Asian American community, and to the work other women have contributed to improving the relationship between Asian and American culture. Section 2: Preparation for the Interview Prior to the interview, we conducted research to learn about Gloria’s background. We found her coaching website, LinkedIn page, and read a preview of her book “Colorful Leadership: How Women of Color Transform the World”. From these we learned that her parents were immigrants from China, she grew up in Brooklyn and Chinatown, and had a strong cultural connection to the Asian American community. She went to Swarthmore University as an undergraduate, got a Bachelor of Arts degree in Political Science, and then went on to Harvard Law school. In the past she was involved in leadership of multiple Asian America political organizations. She was founder, chair, and advisory council president of the Chinatown Youth Initiatives, executive director of the Concessional Asian Pacific American Caucus, and president and CEO of the Asian Pacific American Institute for Congressional Studies (APAICS). Recently, she has been working as a leadership and professional development coach for a wide range of impactful individuals. She is the Senior Vice President at Coach Diversity Institute and the founder of ALCLife, a community of Asian Pacific American coaches that aim to empower other Asian Americans. From what we knew about her, we created a list of questions for the interview that we hoped would relate to the course as well as help us learn more about her as a person. We included mostly broad, open-ended questions to encourage substantial answers and decided to ask any specific questions during the interview. While we were planning, we split the questions into six sections (introduction, biographical, early influences, early career, mid-career/now, and reflections) to chronologically cover her experiences. We sent the following questions to Gloria so that she could get an idea of what we’d be asking during the interview. I. Introduction -What are you trying to accomplish though your career? Why? How have you tried to accomplish these goals? -What are you most proud of in your career? -How do your goals or work relate to women in Asian America? -When you coach women, what do you usually try to help them with? What struggles do they face compared to men? Do women of color face unique challenges? II. Biographical -What kind of family/environment did you grow up in? III. Early Influences -What events/people have influenced your life the most? -How did you decide on your career? Did you have a clear path in mind? IV. Early Career -Were you ever discouraged from your career path? What hurdles have you faced? V. Mid-career/Now -What kind of work do you do now? What do you think you will be doing in the future? -What kind of work do you think is necessary to help underrepresented communities/women? VI. Reflections -Would you have done anything differently? - What do you think it means to be Asian American? Is it different for different generations of Asian Americans or for different ethnicities? Once we scheduled a date for the interview, we found an office where we could have our conversation and decided on how to split up our questions. Isabela planned on asking the introduction and mid-career questions, while Bryanna planned on asking the biographical to early career questions. Finally, both of us would ask the reflection questions and any others that came to mind. Section 3: Conducting the Interview 1) We got detailed and complete answers to our questions, and Gloria usually gave very free responses that encompassed multiple future questions. 2) We were focused on learning about Gloria’s perspectives on different topics, so the interview was mainly unstructured and flexible where we asked most of our questions based on past responses. Instead of asking set questions like we planned, we found it easier to ask questions when we thought of them. To get answers specifically related to the course however, we did ask several structured questions. 3) Gloria was very informative, and we did not feel the need to ask many probing questions. The main probing question we asked was when Gloria stated that she was no longer trying to take advantage of all the privilege and opportunity available to her. We asked her why and to expand on her statement. She stated that chasing after impact put her in a very small container where she could not progress as a person. From our probing question, we were able to get a better understanding of her motivation to change careers. 4) For our team approach, Isabela was more comfortable writing and doing background research than speaking, so Bryanna handled most of the interview while Isabela did a majority of the note taking and outside writing for the project. 5) Gloria did not give us any research topics or references to look up besides the background research we’d already done, but she did mention organizations that she was connected to during the interview (like Coach Diversity Institute and ALC Life) that we could look into later. Section 4: Interview Notes Q: What was your family life like? ● Grandparents were educated (teachers/doctors) and not the proletariat, so their families were persecuted, attacked, and separated ● Parents were refugee immigrants who grew up in China during the Chinese cultural revolution (a bleak time when there was poverty and little food) o Were not allowed to go to school and had to get “re-educated” with farming life ● They realized that staying in China wasn’t a good future for them ○ Her father swam for 7 hours from China to Hong Kong and enrolled in college ○ A year later her mom swam the shorter, but more guarded, route to Hong Kong ■ Got caught the first time and went to jail overnight; second time was a success ○ Stayed in Hong Kong for 2 years ● After receiving their visas to the US in their late 20’s, they moved to NYC, got married and had a baby by the time they were 30 in the US (had no money, didn’t speak the English) Q: What type of environment did you grow up in? ● ● ● Grew up in Starrett City, Brooklyn NY (mixed income housing project, very diverse community) Her sister and her went to public school until 7th grade when they got into Prep for Prep (a nonprofit leadership development program that offers promising students of color access to a private school education) o Was placed in one of the richest private education programs o Had to undergo rigorous testing and training CityKids = youth development and social emotional learning program o Provided Gloria with opportunities for personal growth and artistic expression by helping her channel that growth into substantial social change o Gloria benefited from the leadership component that was about facilitation; enjoyed being at the leadership retreats and talking about self-identity Q: What effects did your family’s background and childhood environment have on you? ● Experiencing a rich student school environment made her aware of the opportunity given to her; understood growing up with modest means ● Felt like she had to utilize the opportunity and represent communities that were being taken advantage of ● Inspired by coalitions from other ethnicities; wanted to be her community’s hero (related to feeling like Spiderman); wanted to show that Asian Americans were also a part of the minority struggle and were not the stereotype of rich and ivy league ● Felt a lot of pressure but didn’t know it at the time because thought it was just what she was passionate about o Never asked herself what she enjoyed and was she was really good at. She just focused on taking the privileges/resources as far as they could go (reason she went to Harvard) ● Today, she feels much less pressure to take privilege as far as it can go because knows that there is more than one way to make a difference in the world o In her 20’s, did everything she was supposed to do (e.g., she cared about policy implications for Asian American communities so she became executive director of the Asian Pacific Caucus, then became president and CEO of the sister non-profit of the caucus (APAICS) ● Chasing after impact put her in a small box and halted her progress as a person, even though her work at the time was meaningful ● She finally took time for herself to find out what made her come truly alive and not what made her feel responsible and good o In high school, she liked going out into NYC and listening to live music (funk and soul) o Thought she was going to quit politics and become a music manager ▪ Her coach at the time helped her realize that managing was just as political as the politics she was trying to get away from ● She then realized that helping people find their voice and courage to put themselves out there was what really drew her in to music. ○ Her coach helped her realize that coaching was what she was interested in; and within a month handed in her resignation to APAICS Q: As a woman communications director, did you ever feel that you were treated differently? ● Explained that most of the time, we internalize oppression and keep ourselves from moving forward; said she already went into the job with a chip on shoulder feeling that way o Was always angry that reporters would overlook Asians and only report on the Black and Latino community ▪ Recalls when a new white guy was placed on her team and he was getting a lot of coverage for their Asian boss. She asked him how he does it, she he said he would make a list of interested reporters, go out for coffee with them, and pitch the stories. ● She then realized that it wasn’t that reporters were purposefully ignoring her or the Asian community, but that they did not know they were around and she didn’t realize because she had a chip on her shoulder. ● From this, she learned to be a better communications director (e.g., got Barack Obama and a lot of media to come to an APAICS event) ● Said we need to realize that we can’t do anything about the outside influences, but can change our internal perceptions of ourselves and the world around us ● Said that as an activist, she was trained to assume the worst (like you need something to fight against), but as a coach learned all that energy could be used to create instead of push against o Said that you need both something to fight against and creation, but a good balance is healthy Q: What advice do you typically give the women you coach? ● ● She doesn’t give advice or tell people what to do. Instead she uses more of a facilitative inquiry strategy, so that people get to their own answers Coaches them about having authenticity in their careers, a sense of confidence and leadership o Has mostly coached women of color; mainly attracts mid-career or those transitioning o E.g., coaching a manager of color that they indeed deserve to be in that high position Q: Do you coach leadership in personal lives or within communities? ● She deals with both an individual's personal life and how they manage and interact with other people in their community o Personal: coaches a lot about family dynamics (especially relationship with her clients previous generation because a lot of who people think they are comes from their parents opinion of them) o Community: focuses on their relationship with authority and autonomy because once you become a leader, that will be how you perceive yourself Q: Do you believe that parents influencing who you are is specific to the family or a culture thing? ● Both; said culture, race and a person's individual stories matter, but all those things don’t need to define who you are ● She’s heard things from white families that are just as bad or guilt/shame ridden as minorities ● In her late 20s, this helped her learn that humanity is universal o Said we shame/guilt ourselves and don’t give ourselves our permission to be our happiest or live our best Q: Do you feel like because you’re a coach you can’t make any mistakes? ● Said not really, but sometimes she doesn't want to tell her story because of how it may unfold to public eye o This is why she didn’t post anything about being pregnant or having the baby Q: What type of work do you see yourself doing in the future? ● Said that moving forward she wants to deal with intergenerational women’s empowerment, where women can become more and more free with each generation (especially as leaders become moms) Q: Could you tell us about your most memorable clients? ● Said she’s had a lot of memorable clients, but the ones that particularly resonate with her are women who have, or their families have, gone through some kind of suffering to understand what it means to be human with a sense of grace ● Said her favorite moments are when she can deeply connect with a client and knows exactly what to ask to have some kind of change happen within them o This is what makes it such a rewarding career for her Q: What does it mean to be an Asian American in the U.S.? ● “It means everything and nothing at the same time” o Explained that it means having family and community histories of struggle, and having the opportunity to work through those so can see more clearly who we want to be and what our communities want to be Q: Are there different struggles for different generations of Asian Americans? ● Yes. Explained she has totally different struggles than her mom ○ She has romantic dreams for her daughter’s future, while her own mom didn’t have time to be romantic because she was fighting to survive in America and get her family over here (her parents laid the foundation that enabled her to think about what kind of legacy she could have) Q: Are there different struggles for different ethnicities? ● Yes, there are different socio-political histories and communities and cultural differences o Explained that at the end of the day... no family history, culture, or socio-political circumstance can restrict who you want to become ▪ She said that without a doubt, it helps shapes who you are, but everybody has choices to make about who they want to become in the future Q: When coaching Asian women specifically, do you find that they tend to face similar struggles? ● Yes, really similar. o Said that most battle with giving themselves permission to “be”, including permission to have a voice/opinion, to have something to offer, to have confidence and believe that they belong where they are. And not feeling a sense of undeserving-ness or unworthiness o Said many issues are culturally specific, but there are differences across Asian ethnicities like how people face disempowerment o Said that overall, the struggle is still opportunity for creating new things ● Cultural example: when her and her sister were born, her mother was disappointed that they were females ○ Explained that her mother spent her whole life proving she could be as worthwhile as a man, and she passed that message and pressure to Gloria and her sister Q: Does your work now still relate to women in Asian America or do you take a broader stance? ● Said she doesn’t work exclusively with the Asian community anymore, but it is still near and dear to her heart and she will always be passionate about it o Explains that this is because thinks about Asian America differently now than in college ▪ In college, she viewed it as a struggle-based community that needed heroes and needed to be saved because it didn’t have a voice (needed a Spiderman). Today, she still sees struggle, but she sees a lot of power and potential in people that don’t need to be saved, but instead are working through their human journey. She now looks to support those who wish to become more powerful versions of themselves ● Explained that there are not that many Asian coaches, so people looking for Asian coaches usually find her ● She founded ALC Life (Asian Life Coach), which is a website and community of support for coaches of AAPI descent [sister org to Black Life Coach] Section 5: Reflections Bryanna: I feel like being assigned to interview Gloria was meant to be. Learning about her parents struggle and experiences were extremely interesting to me, but hearing Gloria speak about finding her passion was what was truly meaningful for me. As I explained to Gloria during the interview, I am beginning to question myself on the choices I have made for my career and the path I decided to take. Ever since hearing Gloria speak about how she had to take a step back and really focus on herself and discovering what truly makes her happy and alive, I have not been able to stop thinking about it. I learned a lot from Gloria, but for me, the most liberating aspect of the interview was learning through her experiences that your hobbies have a lot to do with who you are professionally. Through Gloria, I discovered that chasing my passion may land me somewhere completely different than I am expecting. In addition, her speaking about giving birth and being a mother was extremely intriguing. She caught my attention when she mentioned that men will never be able to feel the same energy that women experience from giving birth, and that was truly powerful to me. I can honestly say that I learned something from each and every word that Gloria spoke, and nothing she said was not useful to the project or to my personal life. My partner comes from an Asian American descent so she related to Gloria in a different way than I did. However, the concepts we discussed in class such as women helping women and the art of social change really helped me view what Gloria was saying from a different perspective. I was glad to see that my classmates also had great experiences with their interviews. I really enjoyed the in-class presentations and seeing the wide range of different occupations and titles that the women being interviewed held. For example, the presentation of Grace Young really stood out to me. Learning about her desire to keep the tradition of the Wok was captivating, mainly because it stood out from other presentations on women in politics, government, and teaching professions. As my undergraduate career comes to an end this semester, and I prepare to walk across the stage in less than 2 weeks, I can honestly say this project was one of my favorites. Besides being assigned to interview an amazing woman like Gloria, the preparation and execution of the interview itself is one I will always remember, and brag about! Isabela: Interviewing Gloria was definitely a valuable experience. Gloria was an insightful person and easy to talk to; and as an Asian American who grew up in a majority immigrant community, a lot of her experiences were relatable. Her transition from a relatively defined career path to a job that she loves and feels herself in is inspiring. It helped me to realize that you should appreciate the opportunities available to you, but you should always value yourself and make sure that that appreciation does not become obligation. For me, the most meaningful things she talked about were people needing to believe that they’re worth it, be the best selves that they can be, and go out and create. People from all ethnicities faces struggles, but those struggles shouldn’t hold people back, and they can result in people with deeper understanding and humanity. It was surprising how much of what Gloria said related to the class. She spoke about enacting change in society by creating new things culturally rather than pushing against institutionalized problems, about intergenerational differences in immigrant communities, and about cultural and historical differences leading to different struggles for different Asian Americans. Everything that she stated was useful as a perspective from someone who spent her entire life in America as an Asian American. Gloria spoke a bit about the issues faced by many Asian American women, like not feeling as confident or as deserving as they should, and I’d like to learn more about Gloria’s feelings growing up. She mainly spoke about feeling the need to be a voice for her community as an adolescent, but she definitely would have been facing other personal struggles related to identity as well. Her book, Colorful Leadership, seems like a good place to learn more about her life in the future. The other in-class presentations were very useful, and I liked how they spanned a broad range of careers and women. Careers ranged from the owner of a laundromat to women with confidential government information. The spread of women interviewed was very inclusive as well, including East Asian, South Asian, 1st generation, 2nd generation, and mixed-race women. I definitely noticed a common theme from all of the interviews, including our own. All of the interviewee’s gave advice to younger women to believe in themselves, value themselves and their culture, and work hard at their goals. Additionally, they acknowledged different struggles specific to their lives and to being a women, like language barriers or political situations. However, it was clear how they collectively believed in future generations of women, regardless of ethnicity, which I think I is the basis for bettering the relationship between America and Asia (or any culture). (1)
• Laura Vega Mariko Kora Final Project SECTION 1 Person interviewed: Interviewee’s title or position: Date, time, and length of interview: Your objective in conducting this interview: The person we interviewed for our final project was Rosemarie Barnett, an Indian-American immigration rights attorney based in New York. The interview was conducted on April 4, 2018 in professor Christoff’s office at 7pm and it approximately lasted for one hour. The interview was done through Google Hangouts and was video recorded.The objective of the interview was to find out about Mrs. Barnett’s childhood, the events that led up to her current position and how her missions and goals as an Asian-American woman relates to US-Asian relations. SECTION 2 Description of the pre-interview research (What did you find out prior to the interview about the person and/or place with which she is affiliated? How did you prepare for the interview?) As soon as we were assigned a prominent Asian-American woman to interview, we began our research. Using keywords such as “Rosemarie Barnett lawyer” and “Rosemarie Barnett immigration”, we found several links on the Google search engine that gave us information about our interviewee. The first link we accessed was Mrs. Barnett’s LinkedIn profile. This provided us with background information such as where she attended both undergraduate and graduate schools, as well as her previous job experiences at large law firms, and her current position at her own firm. The second link we found led us to Mrs. Barnett’s professional website. This website gave us a plethora of information on the practice areas Mrs. Barnett specializes in: immigration, matrimonial/family law, personal injury and commercial litigation. Additionally, it provided us with a list of her pro bono experience, which is one of the topics we decided to ask her about during the interview. Once we had a rough basis of who Mrs. Barnett was and the law firms in which she was affiliated, we drafted questions that would give us more insight on her life before college. We specifically wanted to know more about her life in India because we were unable to find that information through our research. Other questions we wanted to ask Mrs. Barnett related to her career; what steps she took to jump start a career in law and if there were any difficulties she faced along the way because she is an Asian-American woman. Interview Questions 1) Early Childhood/Biographical - Mariko a) We heard that you spent your childhood in India, could you tell us about your experience living there and at what age did you move to the U.S.? i) How was it transitioning to the U.S., what were the biggest cultural shocks you had or differences. ii) Would you identify yourself as American, Indian or Indian-American? iii) How do the gender roles in India differ from the U.S.? b) Could you tell us about your family life in India/the U.S.? i) How do they differ in terms of cultural aspects? ii) Could you tell us about your parents and the influence that they had on you? Do you have any siblings, how was your relationship with them growing up? 2) Education - Laura a) Where did you attend school in India? i) Where did you attend school in the U.S.? ii) How would you compare and contrast these experiences? b) How did you decide upon what you wanted to study/what inspired your interest in law and becoming an attorney? 3) Career highlights Mariko a) We’ve read that you have worked with clients including a constitutional law scholar from China, a transgender woman from Mexico and recent child arrivals from Central American countries, could you expand upon your experience working with these people? i) What are some things you have learned from working with such a diverse clientele? b) How was the transition from working at a law firm to opening up your own practice? Were there any challenges you faced? i) What was the deciding factor that caused you to open your own firm? Laura c) What difficulties (if any) have you faced in your career because you are an Asian American woman? d) Could you give us your opinion on the current US Immigration policy, what or how do you think improvements could be made? (mention DACA) 4) Reflections upon their career/what they would change a) If you could change anything about your life/career, what would you have done differently? Why?​ (Laura) b) Do you still go back to India/do you have any relatives there? What are some ways you embrace your Indian culture/background? ​(Mariko) c) How do you go about finding a career that satisfies you? d) How do you progress in your career/get ahead (as a woman) in India or the U.S.? i) Are the rules of “progressing” up the ladder different for men and women? SECTION 3 1. Did you get complete answers to your questions? Explain Mrs. Barnett was an outstanding interviewee because she always went beyond the confines of the questions we asked her and included plenty of details to further explain her answers. For example, when we asked about her upbringing in India, not only did she tell us about her parents and four other siblings, but she also delved into India’s culture, schools, and general way of life. We were fortunate enough to be able to get very complete and detailed information about Mrs. Barnett’s entire life story in just one hour because of how eloquently she spoke and her overall candidness throughout the interview. 2. Was your interview structured, unstructured, or mixed? Explain Our interview was definitely mixed. A majority of our questions were unstructured because we wanted to get Mrs. Barnett’s opinions and perspectives on a variety of topics such as the current U.S. immigration policy and the differences between how women are treated in India versus the United States. Several of our questions were structured, like “Where did you attend school in India?” but for the most part, it was a good mix of both structured and unstructured. 3. What probing questions did you use? Explain Most of the questions we posed to Mrs. Barnett were probing questions because we had a sense of her background information, but wanted her to go more in depth into her story. Some examples of probing questions include “Could you tell us more about your family life in India and the United States? How did they differ in terms of cultural aspects?” and “​How was the transition from working at a law firm to opening up your own practice? What was the deciding factor that caused you to open your own firm?” 4. Explain your team approach. That is, who did what? When preparing questions for the interview, we worked together to compile a list of both open and closed ended questions for our interviewee. We discussed what we already knew about Ms. Barnett through our previous research and what we wanted to know more about (e.g. India, her childhood, the process of opening her own law firm). During the interview itself, we took turns asking each question, and each of us would expand upon a question or add our own comments to converse with Mrs. Barnett. We also decided to both take notes during the interview to ensure we caught every detail. 5. Did the interviewee give you any documents or references to articles to read, or did she mention other people for you to talk to (or research)? Explain No, Mrs. Barnett did not give us references to people or documents. She did, however, mention Professor Christoff and how the two of them initially met. This topic was brought up during the interview when we asked Mrs. Barnett how she and her family continue to celebrate their Indian culture while living in the United States. Each year, she prepares a large, traditional Indian dinner spread for her friends and family, she dresses in Indian clothing, and even has Indian dance performances and henna tattoo stations, occasionally. Mrs. Barnett revealed that aside from this annual extravaganza, she does not get to celebrate her culture as much as she would like to, but she doesn't feel the need to because she is Indian on the inside and that is enough for her. SECTION 4 Interview Transcript Mariko - ​We heard that you spent your childhood in India, could you tell us about your experience living there, and what age did you move to the U.S? Ms. Barnett - ​I lived in India, I was born and raised there and my father was an Engineer. He was a very hard working man, and we were a family of five kids that moved around alot. He died when I was 10 years old. We also lived in Taiwan for a couple of years, because of his job, we were there when he died. After his death we moved back to India, and it was a tough time because if you know anything about Asian cultures it’s all about legacy and family property - my father’s side of the family started a big family property fight with my mother, and it became a very ugly situation. We ended up without very many resources. I wouldn’t say we were poor, but I wouldn’t say we were comfortable. My mother was a brave woman, she said “I’m gonna invest in one thing, not in your dowries but in your education”. We went to an exclusive boarding school and it set us up for life. I was lucky enough to find out about a scholarship at a small women’s college in Massachusetts and received it, I was 21 by then because I had done a couple of years of college in India. I came with nothing but a couple of bucks in my pocket. My mother was scared to send me off into the world, but I decided that I was here for the long haul and decided to stick it out. The first half of my childhood was very pampered, but then the second half was finding out about how life isn’t so perfect, but it made us very close as a family. Laura - ​Could you talk to us about the cultural shock you had when you came to the United States? Ms. Barnett - ​ Oh my goodness it was culture shock. I came from a very big cosmopolitan city called Bombay (now called Mumbai), to a very small college town in Massachusetts. It was a huge shock in terms of differences in technology. In India at the time we didn’t have any cable television. For example Americanized media such as MTV and seeing a much less repressed society was a culture shock. There was lots of music, drinking and dancing, but the framework was in a small college town. Outside of the college I wasn’t use to hearing the crickets after dark, it was all trees, no tall buildings or cars and the quietness drove me crazy. It felt like I was in a horror movie. I was this big city girl from a third world country but thrown in to a first world country, but in a small town. It was a strange time, and the food was so different too. I would crave my Indian food, but at the same time I found American food great, but it made me so fat. Mariko​ - How do you think the gender roles differ between India and America? Ms. Barnett - ​When I first came here I thought it was a gender or discrimination free paradise in comparison to India. I thought it was so easy to be whatever you wanted to be here, and I still believe this to some extent when compared to India. But now having lived here for 30 years I see that it’s not as perfect as I thought it was in the beginning. When I first got here I thought it was amazing that I could wear shorts, and not having to worry about people touching me or saying dirty things and not having to be escorted by a man. In India I would always buck the norm, and be bold and daring. I come from a small sub-culture of Christians we always spoke English and wore Western clothes, we always stood out, and because we wore western clothes people automatically assumed that we were easy targets. I always grew up feeling uncomfortable. I remember coming back from boarding school often an easy target, but at the time we just thought of it as it is what it is. I remember one time standing up for myself on a bus yelling at the person who was rubbing himself up against me. I told the bus driver to kick him off of the bus, and the bus driver told me to get off of the bus “dressed in a dress like that”. It was a long baggy dress and then he kicked me off. Stuff like this would happen all of the time and I learned that you just had to be quiet, it was ugly horrible stuff. Coming from that and coming to the U.S. it was liberating. Of course there’s violent crimes here , but it seems like nothing compared to there, and if I were doing the things I did here in India it would have been guaranteed that I would be dead or raped. Laura - ​How did you decide you wanted to get in to Law? Ms. Barnett - ​Growing up I was always someone who was very argumentative. People always joked that I should be a lawyer. I never took it seriously, because in India it was very expensive, and my mother did not have the money. We all thought that we had to be practical, so I got a bachelors in commerce. My real true dream was to have become an Engineer, but again the thought of putting my mother through this expense was not acceptable. When I came to the U.S. to a small liberal arts school I just decided to get a Bachelors in Business. I always picked classes based on what was available to me because I was a scholarship student. The law didn’t really happen until I went on to get an MBA and I took a law class which fascinated me and made me think this is what I really wanted to do. When I was in grad school that was when I met my husband to be, we got married after grad school, but then life happened and we had two kids. I put it off for a while, when the the kids were toddlers, I then went on to law school at 31. While I was in law school I also had my daughter. Mariko - ​We’ve read that you have worked with clients including a constitutional law scholar from China, a transgender woman from Mexico and recent child arrivals from Central American countries, could you expand upon your experience working with these people? Ms. Barnett - ​Sure, yeah I’ve always been interested in immigration and helping people who face some very bad experiences. I’ve worked at very large law firms up until 5 years ago. At these law firms they encourage you to do pro bono work. From this avenue I got involved with a couple of nonprofits that do this kind of work. Through Human Rights First I got to represent the Chinese Legal Scholar - just because he wrote a couple of essays about China’s one party system he got thrown into jail we successfully were able to win this case. Once I started my law firm my natural inclination was to focus more on immigration, by taking more classes and getting more training. I represent a lot of children from Central America and getting them special immigrant juvenile status, I also work with a lot of women and families fleeing from the crazy gang violence from these countries. Laura - ​You mentioned that you worked at a lot of large law firms up until a couple of years ago, so can you discuss how it was opening up your own practice? Mrs. Barnett - ​Sure, I never saw myself as someone opening up my own practice, because I saw myself as a big firm kind of person. I thought I would be a cog in a very big machine, and be happy with that. There was a couple of things it was very stressful, and required a lot of hours, hard work and pressure to excel; to be better than anybody else. The work was very tough, and everyone was a type A personality. Honestly there was a lot of discrimination against women, and Asian women, in particular Asian women who were older than the rest. Even though I had graduated second in my class I was recruited by larger firms, but the minute I was there you could tell I was never going to be on partnership track. My destiny was set from day one even though I was thinking I was gonna work really hard, it’s a meritocracy. There was a bias against me and women like me, we would be stuck doing a lot of the boring work such as document work in the background, and we didn’t get to go to court. It was other people who got to go to a courtroom, unless I was doing pro bono work. Institutionally there isn’t a commitment to developing everyone’s careers in a fair and equal way. One time I remember going to a job interview as a third year law student, and half way through the interview the guy told me I know you’re smart but im going to say no because your kids are the same age as my kids, and my wife and I met at this law firm as first year associates, and right now she’s home because three kids requires one parent to be home. I couldn’t believe at how sexist that was , and I told him right away there’s going to be one parent the dad. He said I’m doing you a favor, I know you want a career but this kind of career at a white shoe firm is not for you. I swear if that happened to me 10 years later I would have made a big stink over it on social media. Most people are not going to stand up and say something because they just want their career going. That’s what I did I was highly offended and highly upset, but didn’t do anything more I really should’ve pushed now that I think about it, it was a missed opportunity. But I thought, do you really want to be labeled as a trouble maker? So you just decide to walk away from those fights. So, that was one of the reasons I left the big law arena. Bottom line I was a mom I had other responsibilities, I wasn’t just solely a career person. The money was super rewarding in a big firm, but in other ways it was not good at all. In 2012 hurricane Sandy hit and it destroyed my house; that was dealing with being “homeless” and living in a motel, it just made me realize I can’t do the 14 hour days in the city anymore. I was thinking maybe I’ll just do some contract work, but then I decided to start my own practice. It was very scary, but I had a friend who had started already and she showed me the nuts and bolts. Mariko​ - Could you give us your opinion and current U.S. immigration policy, what or how do you think improvements could be made? Ms. Barnett​ - How the laws are being implemented are very draconian, everyday there are new changes being made. For example with marriage petitions you find that there’s more requests from the government such as the number of interviews and denials which have increased. It’s like the law in some ways has remained the same, but the way they are implementing it is stricter. In Immigration court it’s way worse, before we use to be able to settle out certain cases if they werent a risk to national security, and they were here basically because they’re running away from violence or poverty, they weren’t going to be a problem in this country. A lot of times you would have to write a memo as to why they’re deserving - like a plea bargain, and now they don’t do this anymore. Every case has to go to trial, every trial is strictly enforced against the immigrants, and it’s very tough. Immigration policy needs to change, yes I agree that we need to have better security at the borders, but at the same time this is a country of immigrants, and it doesn’t make any sense that we have millions and millions of people that live here undocumented. A lot of these undocumented people are paying taxes and are working really hard but there’s no way for them to become documented and become a part of American society. I believe that so many people are left uninformed. I felt that under Obama, the law enforcement side was kept strong, and it tried to keep families united, but he also deported a lot of people too, but at the sametime if they were families, children and women and fleeing from violence they had a fighting chance, but now they don’t. I really hope that things change in Washington, something needs to be done. Anyone who practices immigration law is sick to the stomach as to how bad it is. I have a trial coming up and I have to prepare my clients ahead of time to save money ahead of time, because I know they’re not going to win. It’s hard to think of these people who are so hopeful. People say they arrived here with no VISA, but may be we would be doing the same thing if we were facing the same violence and threats to ourselves. General violence is not enough for an asylum case. The laws are very complicated, you have to be a legal scholar to understand half the laws out there. Laura:​ So we know that you opened your own practice only five years ago, but so far if there’s anything you would change about your life or career what would you have done differently? Ms. Barnett:​ I think I would have started my own law practice a while ago, actually. To think of the 12 or 13 years that I spent at these big firms.. Yeah it was decent money but it was at such a cost. Like I said, I always felt I was the back room lawyer; I felt like I never had a chance and it was always exhausting...and you’re always terrified of being fired because everyone is so good! Everyone’s a star from their own hometown or their own law school so it’s the best of the best. You’re either in the top 5% of a smaller law school or you’re from an Ivy league so everybody’s a type A, flashy kind of person and it’s exhausting to be there all the time. I feel like, yeah, it was an accomplishment to swim in those waters but for personal happiness, which is actually something very important, and people don’t give it as much importance, especially women, I think I would have done this a long time ago. If I look back, I should have been practicing by myself for 10 to 12 years by now, instead of just 5. Mariko:​ Going back to India: ​Do you still go back and do you have any relatives there? What are some ways you embrace your Indian culture/background? Ms. Barnett:​ I don’t go home as much as I’d like to; the last time I went was in 2015 for my sister’s 25th wedding anniversary. My mom lives with me now, which makes traveling hard. My kids also like India; one of my kids who’s in college spent a summer there, but the other two haven’t had a chance [to go] yet. We’re very Indian at home, but like I told you earlier, we’re from a subculture from India that is more Westernized anyway. One of the ways we celebrate is once a year, I throw this big Indian dinner and I cook everything. This is how I met your professor, as a matter of fact! I don’t get to celebrate being Indian that often but I feel like I’m so Indian to the core that I don’t need to celebrate it because I am it! Laura: ​What advice would you give to people in our generation who are looking to find a career that is satisfying for them in the long run? Ms. Barnett:​ I have this conversation with my children a lot, actually, and their friends too. I find a lot of people in your age group are very lost because there’s so much pressure on you guys. You’ve grown up in a world where there’s a lot of information out there at all times but you guys get bombarded too much. You’re already so jaded because you’ve seen the world through this lense where you see the good and the bad, and the bad seems to come hurtling at you all the time because of the media. You guys have a lot on your plates and I would say the one thing you should really focus on is to try and drown out all those negative voices. The good thing about living in this generation is that there are way more opportunities for you. You have to be creative, you have to keep thinking, and my biggest piece of advice to people your age is that life is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you really want it, it will happen. Mariko:​ ​How do you progress in your career/get ahead (as a woman) in India or the U.S.? Are the rules of “progressing” up the ladder different for men and women? Ms. Barnett:​ Yes, absolutely! One thing that women do is that we work very hard; we always think if you work really hard and you hand in a piece of work that’s perfect, you will be rewarded. We automatically have this really great work ethic. Always do that anyway, but we have to borrow from the men’s playbook. We have to learn how to brag about ourselves, we have to learn how to market, we have to be shameless self promoters. I still find that hard, but then I realize, ‘Wait a minute, I have accomplished quite a bit,’ and you should be unabashed about promoting yourself in the workplace. Let your work speak for itself, absolutely, but also learn how to take an opportunity. The deck is not stacked in our favor. Once you understand the rules, you’ll win. Laura: ​In India, do you think women still face the same struggles progressing next to men? Mrs. Barnett:​ Absolutely. It’s still hard there, there’s still a lot of violence around women. It’s hard to be a woman in India in that sense because you still have to worry about things like sexual harassment. You cannot work super late at night unless you know for sure that there’s a car to take you home; the biggest perpetrators of this violence are cab drivers. In India right now there’s an extremist right-wing movement; it’s all about returning to traditional principles and that’s actually bringing the rights of women even lower. Career-wise, it is getting a little better for women. There’s a lot more opportunities, but if you ever asked me if I would go back to live in India I would say no. The bottom line is, it’s not a place to establish a career. And that’s what I have to say about that. Both:​ Thank you so much for your time, we really appreciate it. SECTION 5 What aspects of the interview did you find to be particularly meaningful? An aspect of the interview that we found to be particularly meaningful was hearing about the difficulties and discrimination that she faced as an Asian American women. Although these kind of experiences may be shocking or painful to some we thought that they are what build character, and makes an individual stronger in some cases. For instance when Mrs. Barnett discussed the time that she was rejected by a law firm due to being a mother of two, it was particularly shocking, but it gave us insight on how even in a country such as the U.S. that represents itself as liberalized and open, women are discriminated against solely for their gender. Although her husband was fully capable of taking care of their children, the fact that she was a woman made it unacceptable for her to hold the position as the breadwinner in the family. Initially when coming to the U.S. Mrs. Barnett believed the states to be completely discrimination free, but instances like this made her realize that this was not the case. Another meaningful aspect of the interview was her emphasis on the importance of personal happiness and how ultimately life is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Particularly, we found the career advice that she gave to us as young women of our generation to be quite memorable. She stated that in order to overcome the barriers that we face as women, we need to become more assertive and appeal to others about our capabilities and to borrow from the “men’s playbook”, since “the deck is not stacked in our favor - [but] once you get the rules of the game you’ll be able to win” . This quote really stuck out to us because it emphasized how much women are at an disadvantage in society, but with some effort and utilizing more masculine qualities women can become just as successful. Just as it was emphasized in the missing 33 percent video in class, women are often times not properly taught or given the tools to become leaders. This is often done not on purpose, but naturally which is why it is essential to actively make society realize that women need to be taught the rules of the men’s playbook. What aspects were not useful? What more would you like to know? Although we did not find any of the aspects of the interview to be unuseful, we thought that if we were students that were interested in pursuing a career in immigration law the interview would have been even more meaningful in further understanding the career. For example we asked her about how she would change the current immigration law system and her experiences working with a diverse clientele and she also gave us very detailed and raw responses on the difficulties that many refugees and immigrants face today in obtaining citizenship. Although neither of us are planning to pursue a career in law, the discussion sparked a lot of interest on how the current political climate is after the change from Obama to Trump, as well as how many of the undocumented citizens today are struggling to become accepted and integrated in to a part of American society. After conducting the interview we thought that we would like to learn more about her siblings and how their lives turned out to be despite having a similar upbringing as Mrs. Barnett. We also thought that we would further like to hear and discuss her work and experience on the cases she is presently dealing with and more about her work life as an attorney. During the one hour we spent with her we were able to get a great grasp and idea of her personality, upbringing and how her experiences have made her to be the person that she is today. In terms of personal details she was very open with us, so there was not particularly anything that we were missing from her in that aspect. What other in-class presentations did you find particularly useful? During the in-class presentations we learned about many different Asian-American women with interesting backgrounds and careers. On the first day of presentations we learned about Nancy Wang who was a dancer and social worker, her goal was to help serve the people in her community and to blend the gap between the West and East Asian culture. On the second day of presentations we learned about women Such as Amy Hall who is the VP of Eileen Fisher a women’s wear company that heavily promotes environmental sustainability, as well as Sarah Park a woman who runs a laundromat business with her husband, and cherishes her family and Christianity with pride. We found the presentation on Mrs. Park to be quite useful because of how different her background and career was in comparison to other women. Despite not having the most prestigious career, her story gave us insight on how many Asian immigrants who do not come from the most privileged backgrounds pursue and work endlessly to make a career for themselves. On the last day of presentations we learned about women including Dr. Ling Ling Ho who grew up in a privileged family in China, but was keen on pursuing education, and was very much aware of her privilege. We thought that this quality in Dr. Ho was similar to how Mrs. Barnett valued her education and used it to prepare herself for the world. Dr. Ho enlisted in the army, and started off as a nurse but later went on to pursue her medical degree, and the biggest struggle she faced came from having a language barrier. We also learned about Sarah-Ann Smith an ex foreign service officer, writer and professor whose main goal was to help people better understand each other and similarly to Nancy Wang was to bridge the gap between U.S. and China. The main thing we took away from viewing everyone’s presentations was seeing the similarities and differences between every woman, but observing how each individual woman’s experience woven together completes the fabric of women in US-Asian relations. The interview we had with Rosemarie Barnett was absolutely delightful, she was an extremely eloquent and engaging speaker and before we had realized, we had spent nearly an entire hour speaking to her. She was very transparent with us throughout the interview and from learning about her childhood in India, to her journey in discovering her current career path, we were able to obtain a meaningful understanding of her experiences and life as an Asian American woman. (1)
• Melissa Yanfen Huang & Tenzin Kunsel AAS 307 Final project 05/01/18 SECTION ONE (5 points) Person interviewed: Nancy Yao Maasbach Interviewee’s title or position: President of Museum of Chinese American (MOCA) Date, time, and length of interview: April 10, 2018 at 2:00 PM. Length of interview: 1 hr 3 minutes. Your objective in conducting this interview: To learn and understand the role of Nancy Yao Maasbach as an influential woman in the U.S-Asian relations and how her enriched experience in different Chinese communities shaped her goals as the president of MOCA. SECTION TWO (10 points) Description of the pre-interview research (What did you find out prior to the interview about the person and/or place with which she is affiliated? How did you prepare for the interview?) List your interview questions. Before the interview, we searched the name ‘Nancy Yao Maasbach’ on Google, in hopes of finding out more information about her. We read her biography on the MOCA website, which gave us a general idea about her accomplishments in life and experiences she had prior taking the role as the president of MOCA. We learned that she was the perfect representation of the U.SAsian relations as she had many years of experience both living and working in Chinese communities. Then, we moved on to her linkedin account to see her education background and professional experience. We found out that she had attended Hunter College High School and moved on to Occidental College where she earned her Bachelor's in Diplomacy and World Affairs. Then, she moved onto Yale University where she received her Master of Business Administration from the Yale School of Management. During her undergraduate years, she was involved in research in China studies, which most likely gave her the exposure to the field that she was truly interested in. She moved on to working overseas where she was constantly involved in different Asian communities. After this in depth pre-interview research, we could not wait to find out more about her and how her experiences shaped her as the influential woman she is today. In order to prepare for the interview, Melissa and I decided to first check if our laptop was functioning properly to avoid any technical difficulties while conducting the interview. After checking, we agreed to equally split the questions that we were going to ask. Thus, Melissa asked the first 8 questions and I asked the remaining 7 questions on our list. After splitting the questions, we practiced our own parts on our own. Later, we came together and did a quick rundown of what our actual interview would run like. While doing the rundown, there were times where Melissa and I would pause and not know what to say. During those moments, we agreed to exchange encouraging words to prevent awkward silence when conducting the interview. This strategy allowed for our actual interview to run smoothly without any confusion among us, and the interviewee. Interview questions: 1. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself? Ethnicity, education, languages you can speak, hobbies,etc. 2. How was your childhood like growing up in New York City as Asian American? 3. Did your childhood have an impact on your professional career? 4. Were you the first one ever to attend college in your family? 5. How was your college experience? 6. How did your college experience shape you into who you are today? 7. Do you believe your major/minor played an important role in becoming the President of MOCA? 8. Why did you want to take that major/minor? 9. Was there ever a time where you were in denial of your Asian ethnicity? 10. Have you ever been treated differently as a woman with Asian background in the professional field? 11. Did this apply into some of your professional pursuits you’ve taken such as in Goldman Sachs? 12. Can you describe your experience working in Hong Kong after you left Goldman Sachs? 13. What were some of the challenges you faced while transitioning? 14. Now that you are the President of MOCA, what are some future goals that you would like to accomplish for MOCA and the greater Asian community? 15. Is there anything else that you would like to add? SECTION THREE (10 points; 2 points each) 1. Did you get complete answers to your questions? Explain We got complete answers to most of our questions. We started off the interview Skype call by asking her to “Tell us a little bit about yourself, including your ethnicity, education”, which was an open ended question. From this question, she gave us a very thorough response. She told us about growing up in NYC where she faced racism as a young girl and went on to other topics from there. Since she was very well spoken and provided us with a lot of information, she even answered some of the questions we had on our question list as she was telling us about her experiences growing up. There was one question that we felt she did not fully understand, which was when we asked her “Have you ever been treated differently as a woman with Asian background in the professional field?”. In the process of answering this question, she had to pause a few times to think. She told us about some of the story of her ‘cheating the system’ by not paying for metrocard fare when she would go on the subway with her father. She felt that it was wrong and confronted her father about it, but her father saw it as her being rebellious because “no one was looking” anyways. We felt that her story related to another question we asked her earlier, which was related to her being in denial because of her Asian ethnicity. Though she did carry on to tell us that there were circumstances where men would tell her inappropriate things at the professional workfield, we were looking forward to find out if she faced any discriminties working as an Asian American woman. We felt that she could add on more information to it. 2. Was your interview structured, unstructured, or mixed? Explain Before conducting the interview, Melissa and I thought the interview would be structured since we had practiced earlier before the interview. However after interviewing Miss Nancy, the the interview turned out to be a mixed interview. Melissa and I agreed that it was a mixed interview because Miss Nancy was able to provide answers to questions that were asked, and also gave additional information which answered some of our other questions that were yet to be asked. This prompted us to formulate and ask follow-up questions on spot, and also actively listen. These follow up questions paved the way for the next set of questions that were yet to be answered, and it also helped guide our conversation. 3. What probing questions did you use? Explain Many probing question ranging from Miss Nancy’s ethnicity, childhood growing up in Flushing, Queens, her college and work experiences, to her current position as the president of Museum of Chinese in America were asked. Of them, we asked Miss Nancy, “Can you describe your experience working in Hong Kong after you left Goldman Sachs? What were some of the challenges you faced while transitioning?”. When asked about her experience in Hong Kong working for Goldman Sachs, and the challenges she encountered after quitting her job and making the new transition, Miss Nancy answered saying that while living abroad, “you have a lot more time by yourself...to observe and process” things. After discussing about the “alone time” that Miss Nancy had while working in Hong Kong, Miss Nancy connected it back to her time working in Goldman Sachs where she felt like she had to “prove” herself. Moreover, she wished that she was more mature at the time. These were good probing questions to ask because we were able to truly understand her motive behind why she decided to quit her job at Goldman Sachs, and how she was able to recover and find herself during the “alone time” she had. Overall, her intriguing responses truly influenced the course of our interview and the follow up questions that we asked after. 4. Explain your team approach. That is, who did what? Our team approach was by splitting up the work into half between Tenzin and Melissa. Melissa met with Professor Christoff to obtain interviewee’s contact information and confirmed the interview letter that was sent to the interviewee afterward. Then, Melissa reached out to Nancy Yao Maasbach and maintained communication with the interviewee via email while Tenzin sent out email reminders to the interviewee before our official interview on 4/10/18. For the list of questions we asked Nancy Yao Maasbach, Melissa came up with the first 8 questions, meanwhile Tenzin came up with the remaining 7 questions to finish up the Skype Call interview. When the interview was done, Melissa typed the transcripts for the first half of the interview, meanwhile Tenzin typed the other half of the transcript. In preparation for the presentation slides, Melissa uploaded the complete interview video to her google drive and shared it with Tenzin so each of us can find specific clip from the interview that answer the question to each of our slides. Melissa was responsible for the ‘Content’ slide and Tenzin was responsible for the ‘Process’ slide. Lastly, for the final report, Melissa and Tenzin split up the questions evenly again. This time, Melissa answered the questions relating to the contents meanwhile Tenzin answered the questions relating to the process of the interview/presentation. 5. Did the interviewee give you any documents or references to articles to read, or did she mention other people for you to talk to (or research)? Explain The interviewee did not provide us with any articles to read, but she did mention at the end of the Skype Call that if we ever needed another woman to have an interview on, she would be happy to provide us with the names and contact information upon request. SECTION FOUR (30 points) Insert your interview notes/write up here. Remember to be accurate and concise. Consider what was said, any emerging trends your interviewee mentioned, different interpretations, and recommendations for follow up interviews. Interview Notes Nancy grew up in Flushing, NY, in a bilingual family. Nancy speaks mandarin, she is Shanghainese & Chongqing descent. She felt that she had the “Soft image”, but she did not want to let her soft looks deceive others and take advantage of her. There was a time when her classmates on the school bus randomly made fun of her for being Chinese, she fought back by cursing them out with the ‘F’ word. This was her very first encounter of racism.That was when she realized the power in her, that she is not willing to settle and let boundaries confine her.” She also mentioned how people would group her with other Asians in her class, and said how “Kenny Lee was destined to be with her.” She Went to Hunter college high school, president of student body, soft ball player, had a role in theater (got the script she wanted) but she had to give it up because her priority to get into a prestigious college like Harvard. However, she got rejected from Harvard. Rejection from Harvard allowed her to realize that she was not mature enough. At Hunter, she felt mediocre because she was not performing well academically. In middle school, it was easy for Nancy to get good grades which is why she said that her middle school didn’t prepare her enough because she had to compete with people who were not first generation immigrants. At Occidental College, her English professor pulled her out and asked her if Chinese was her second language. She felt targeted and unintelligent. She said this was due to reason that Hunter didn’t educate them on grammar. That’s why she felt like she wasn’t able to write at a college level, and often time she finds herself messing up her grammar while talking. However, she corrects herself when this happens. At Occidental, she minored in theater. She said that mentorship from an early age would’ve helped her to discover her career path in theater. This is why she truly encourages Asian Americans to have this relationship because it is important to get guidance and find what you are passionate about. Moreover, she wants to inspire Asian Americans born in the U.S. and Asia to pursue careers that they want to pursue. When applying for jobs, Nancy was looking for a company that was well known and had prestige. That was Goldman Sachs. Nancy said getting accepted to work in Goldman Sachs was sort of like a redemption to get back at not getting accepted to Harvard. When they hired her, they thought she was a “China Hire”, but she had to confront them that she was not from China. Even though she was fluent in Chinese, she was not from China and thus did not have any relationships with other investment bankers in Shanghai or Beijing that will help promote the company. Her encounter with a coworker at G.S. made her realize that she doesn’t want to work there. Also, Nancy felt like she was a minority when working in Goldman Sachs. Nancy’s father worked for the first airplane company “Pan American” that gave them free tickets for international travel. This gave nancy the exposure to international relation from a young age. This also allowed Nancy to enjoy travelling and enjoy the process. Nancy’s mom went to college in Taiwan for a year, but never finished, and came to U.S went to bilingual school in New York. She remembers helping her mom with her college essays when she was 7 years old, and told her mother to improve her English. Thus, she did by subscribing to a magazine that had essays, and her mom would read it and translate it. Nancy used all her Chinese new year red pocket money ($60) and applied to Yale theater program, but did not get accepted. She realized she did not try hard enough, and said she “winged it” without enough practice, and was not mature enough for the program. She also talked about the disadvantages being an Asian women. For instance, there were a lot of uncertainties about her potential, and inappropriate jokes were made in the international relations field that she was pursuing. Nancy briefly talked about the modesty of Asians and Asian Americans through her parents experience when they attended her 2nd grade parent teacher conference. She can resonate with this modesty when people praise her for her accomplishments. When people compliment her, she finds herself being modest with the compliments. Thus, her husband encourages her to accept the compliments when people compliment her. Furthermore, Nancy mentioned that she puts the museum first and cares more about building a positive reputation for MOCA than receiving an award for her service. As a result, she finds it hard to balance being a good wife and a good mother, and often feels like her professional and personal persona are different. “In China’s development, the markets were really beginning to form and I love the macro, the macroeconomic, the macro political components of living it and breathing it. I mean before I worked there in Hong Kong was Goldman starting in 1999, and I had worked there in 96’ and 97’ in two instances with CNN. I had followed the pre hand over and then the handover coverage for CNN. I love it. I was such an observer in that space...If you meet me in person, people are always like “oh” you’re so outgoing and all this, but I think in the core I really do like to research and study what is happening in the dynamics. Like I’ve had a lot of time alone. When you live abroad in international settings you have a lot more time by yourself and that's something I’ve learned to appreciate and I do appreciate. There’s a lot of that time on the plane, when you’re by yourself. There’s a lot of that down time when your family is not living with you because you’re 10,000 miles away that you’re by yourself and you’re having a cup of coffee by yourself. And there’s a lot of that time in Hong Kong when you’re an expat or whatever you want to call it where you have a lot of time to observe and take down things so because I’ve had that very international sort of random places, I just feel like I’ve had a lot more time to observe and process some of those experiences. And it was good It was a very good time I did theater on the side as well there And it was difficult I felt like I had to prove myself In a somewhat tricky environment where There were assumptions about me. I felt like they hired me because they thought I was the China hire and I kept like saying Look I'm from Flushing, Queens Like born and raised. I speak Mandarin But I'm not your China hire I don't know anyone in Shanghai. I don't know anyone in Beijing And I mean my Mandarin is good but i'm not a native speaker. I’m catching up with myself a lot and my professional career, I kind of always feel like there are pockets of things I didn’t get exposed to. I feel like I wish I was a little bit more mature when I was working at Goldman. There weren’t a lot of people I knew who were investment bankers at Goldman and so I was really trying to figure out a lot of that by myself and also as a woman. You think about some of the people you may know. There are like generations of bankers, and some of them are White Anglo Saxons or they’re Jewish Americans and their parents and their grandparents are all bankers or their uncle was a banker. I really didn’t have anyone I knew who was a banker. I had to trial and error a lot of stuff.” “Everything after [Goldman] seemed easy after that. I wanted to leave Goldman because to be honest I felt that you know I paid back my loans that was a big part of my comfort level. And I kind of felt like my personality was changing a little bit, and I didn’t like that about myself. That was one thing. You know I’m Christian. My parents aren’t but I am. I went to church on my own from a very young age and I think fundamentally I was always seeking how I could be a more loving person. And I think for some reason and I’m not blaming Goldman. I don’t think it’s a Goldman culture persay because certainly there are people who are god fearing good people working at Goldman, but for some reason the culture was affecting me in a way that I felt like I wasn’t being the best person I could be, and so like the moment sort of woke up to that and I think it was some interaction I had with a stranger where I wasn’t too sure. I was unhappy with myself in just that interaction, and it gave me a quick wake up call and I thought maybe my time is done in this institution. Then, getting myself right with who I am and how I want to interact with people on a daily basis regardless of where I worked. I think that was really important for me to sort of understand and recapture that. Everything else after I feel like it’s been pretty straight forward and really wonderful and special.” “ I was trying to redeem myself in a lot of ways… Goldman was a little bit of my redemption path. I’m good enough and I’m gonna look for the most difficult job that is the most competitive at the best firm. I felt satisfaction from getting it… it was something that I needed to accomplish to… it was making up time for something that I have not accomplish or didn’t live up to my potential.” SECTION FIVE (25 points) Your analysis: What aspects of the interview did you find to be particularly meaningful? What aspects were not useful? What more would you like to know? What other in-class presentations did you find particularly useful? Explain My partner and I found the actual interviewing aspect of the interview, being able to see her emotions through the videochat to be particularly meaningful. When our interviewee, Nancy Yao Maasbach, talked about growing up being pushed into certain roles because of her gender and the constant pressure to be a successful woman, we could see that it was a time of uncertainties for her. There was a lot of pauses when she thought back to this part of her memory and all the things she could have done to pursue acting. Preparing a bunch of questions for the interviewee to answer was not useful because she answered most of the questions as she talk about her childhood, education, professional agendas and family relations. I would like to see the different roles she has in her daily life. I would like to know more about how Yao Maasbach’s days goes in a work day as the president of the museum and how she spends the remaining time with her family as a wife and mother. From the many excellent in-class presentations, I found the presentation on Sarah Park to be particularly useful because it portrays the life of a traditional Asian woman. The in person interview at Ms.Park’s laundromat makes the whole interview more realistic and relatable. At some point when Ms.Park mentioned about saving up money for her children’s education by not having a cellphone, it was very touching to see how much a mother can give up to contribute for her family. When she describes her strong devotion for God, I see a similarity between the missionary women we learned about earlier in class and their great dedications to missions motivated by their religion. Overall, the class itself and the readings provided us an in depth analysis on women and their international relations. We learn to appreciate and understand the works of women more than before. (1)
• Nancy Wang and Her Career/Goals The women we interviewed is Nancy Wang. First let me briefly summarize the basic information of her, her job, her career, her mission goal and the relation between her and the women’s role in US-Asian relations. Nancy Wang is an Asian American. She was born and brought up in Louisiana, and now she is living in San Francisco, California, with her husband. Her father was American while her mother was Chinese. During her life, she desired to work in areas where she would serve people. Later on in life, her desire was to work as a dancer. Based on the interview, we know that Nancy’s father used to work for the State Department of security, he served as a common general in New Orleans, and her Mother was a Nurse. Due to her Parents job and the daily life influence of her parents, she said she was brought up with a good values and morals. She always knew that everyone has a duty to help others and serve for the community, the societies. Nancy’s first job after school was as a social worker. In there she helped different kinds of people by counseling them. According to what she said, the majority of the clients she took care of are all similar to her -- Asian American women. Her major work is to help them understand the difference between the western and eastern cultures, and how to balance these two. Later on, after finishing the career of a social worker, she become a dancer and contributed to spread the ancient Asian tale, myth and some other cultures by the 1 traditional dance performance. Being a dancer also finally caused her to meet her future husband. See this man, he is Nancy’s husband, Robert Kikuchi. He is a Japanese American, same as Nancy, he also devote his life to be the Asian traditional dancer and a storyteller. Career/Goals and Her Mission and How She Is Fulfilling Them When we asked about her mission goal, Nancy claimed that her goals in life were to help people. Although later she changed her career from working with people to working for people. She was very successful in achieving and fulfilling her goals on helping people. Like what I just mentioned, she started a counseling organization where she worked as a social worker. During the years she worked as a social worker, she helped many people especially the younger women realize their potential. Her main aim was to blend the gap between the western culture and the eastern one, especially teaching them how they ought to regard either of the cultures. As a dancer, she travelled different places inspiring people through music. She was able to overcome the stigmatization of Asian and American and taught others the same. As a storyteller, she works with her husband Kikuchi, they created many kinetic stories, and many of them are focus on the topic of Asian folktales, immigration history, and some stories relate to her own life experience and the other Asian’s daily life in this country. This couple always use their great wisdom and life experience to combine those things, combine the music, dance, theater and the storytelling together to present for many countries audience. Like this picture, it’s in San Francisco’s Asian community, and they were performing opera which is about the traditional folktale in ancient China. Relation between her goals and career to that of women’s roles in US-Asian relations Finally ask about the relation between her and the women’s role in US-Asian relation. She conclude that In her life, especially her mission and career, relates greatly with that of Asian Americans women in US. Many of them struggle to feel at home without being isolated or discriminated against. They focus on building their career and helping others. That is what the life of Nancy is all about. Dancing, helping other, trying to feel accepted, studying, are some of the roles supported by the majority of Asian American women. 1 After introducing ourselves and thanking Mrs. Wang for allowing us to conduct the interview, we began by asking an open-ended question: “Tell us a little about yourself and you career?”. This followed by more open-ended questions such as: “How has being a woman affected your career and how has that played a role in how you have performed and written your plays?” and “What do you think are the biggest cultural differences between China and the United States?”. These questions really provided us with an enormous wealth of information and even covered some questions that we didn't get a chance to formally ask Mrs. Wang. During one exchange, Mrs. Wang talks about how being a woman has affected her career and elaborates that although being one has had an impact on her experiences and career choices, she felt that her experiences couldn't be reduced to one characteristic about herself. She says that this is “what they call…” “I can’t remember the name”,” something about a crossover of things, as a female, as a minority, as an ethnic person of color, and all these ways that they crisscross each other and you don’t know what’s affecting what”. I respond by saying that that’s what you call “intersectionality” and she responds by saying “thank you, yes, that’s the word”. This was one of the best examples of active listening in the entire interview. (Top Audio) Because our interview was audio only, we could only pick up on nonverbal cues. 2 During one part of the conversation, when talking about the differences between Chinese and American cultures, Mrs. Wang talks about how Asian Americans appear less confident than European Americans because of some of the cultural differences between the East and West. She explains that this appearance isn't so much a product of Asian Americans actual being less confident than other people, but rather a display of humility that is more prevalent in Asian cultures. For a brief instance she talks from the perspective of someone who mischaracterizes Asian people. From the way that she talks during this part of the interview, it was clear to me that she doesn't appreciate people who do this. The tone that she uses expresses a genuine sort of contempt for these attitudes. (Bottom Audio) 2 (1)
• Roberta Lipson is the cofounder and Chairwoman of United Family Healthcare, the largest operator of for profit hospitals in China. Roberta founded its flagship facility, Beijing Family Hospital in 1997, after earning the trust and respect of Chinese officials; many of whom were skeptical at first of privatized healthcare services in China, given their sordid past. As we’ve learned from the article Opportunities and Obstacles for Women Physicians in the Twenty-First Century, ”the mere presence of more women in medicine is not enough to produce a better healthcare system”. Roberta represents a shift towards equality within the governing bodies of hospital systems. Not only does Roberta act as the Chairwoman of United Family Healthcare, but she also routinely serves as a board member on both the American Chambers of Commerce in China and the U.S. China Business Council. Roberta spoke on the gender disparity she routinely sees in her professional life. (Play clip 19:15- 20:11) This disparity has not caused Roberta to become callused or defensive. On the contrary, as she puts it, “we have a […] consensus-driven leadership approach in our company, and I wouldn’t change it so I could look more like a man”. 1 The questions we asked Roberta Lipson were centered around her personal life and how her successful businesses have affected it. Being a woman in her position within a patriarchal country may be hard for some, but Roberta seems to handle it with grace and humility. She goes in depth about how she was able to give her all to her business. (quote) basically reiterating the “it takes a village saying”. In hindsight she does wish she could of spent more time with her family but she knows they’re proud of her nonetheless. She goes on to speak about the future of United family Healthcare by stating what her initial goals were and how the company has reached and exceeded her expectations. (quote) By evolving with the times but still keeping true to the initial identity of the company United Family Healthcare. 2 (1)
• Sandy Cho & Katie Lim AAS/POL 307 Professor Christoff May 9, 2018 Final Report Section One: Person interviewed: Eileen Lui Interviewee’s title or position: Founder of “Children of Tomorrow”, Coach/Mentor, Entrepreneur, Marketing Communications (MARCOMs) Consultant, Author, Certified Fitness Trainer, and a housewife. Date, time, and length of interview: April 16, 2018; 9 PM Eastern Time (7:30 AM Myanmar Time); 1 hour, 3 minutes and 24 seconds. Your objective in conducting this interview: Our main goal was to ask Eileen Lui about her childhood, her parents’ careers, her mission and goals in life, and how she came to accomplish them. Overall, we wanted to get an idea of the steps she took to get to where she is now in her life. Section Two: Prior to the interview Katie and I prepared ourselves by collecting any information we could get on Eileen via social media, LinkedIn account, previous interviews in Myanmar media, and YouTube videos. We were fortunate to get a handful of information and data on Eileen Lui. Since she is very well known in Myanmar, it was not hard for us to conduct a background search. These were the sources we used to gather Eileen’s information prior to the interview: http://www.asianentrepreneur.org/eileen-lui-soyai/; https://www.linkedin.com/in/eileen-lui419448/; https://www.myanmore.com/yangon/author/eileenlui/; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMhQaWE-q7o; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ByvrogCTMg; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_ZmB_uCGPY; https://www.facebook.com/cotyouthcentre/; https://www.facebook.com/unwomenasia/photos/a.125861380908222.24093.124151414412552/ 755807207913633/?type=3&theater. After going through all these sources, we narrowed it down to what questions we still needed to ask and what questions we could follow up on. We didn’t want to ask her the questions that were typically thrown at her in other interviews, so we decided to create interesting open-ended questions. We created 15 questions in total. Google docs. was our platform to share these questions and make necessary edits, if needed. The plan was to take turns asking each question. Due to the conflict in all our schedules, we had to come up with a day and time to conduct this interview. Time zone difference was another obstacle for us, since Eileen was 12 hours ahead of us. Eileen is also a very busy woman and for her to make time was difficult. In the end, Katie and I decided to go by Eileen’s availability. Eileen said she’s usually available early in the morning which is night time here. At first, we didn’t know where to find a place for the interview. Finally, on the day of the interview, we tried to reserve a room in the library but they were all occupied and outside the library was too loud for us to conduct the interview. Eventually, we found an empty space on the second floor of the Student Activities Center. I arrived half an hour early before the interview to set up the laptop, and to make sure the camera 2 and recording application were all working properly to avoid any potential technical issues. These were the questions we asked Ms. Lui: Interview Questions: Childhood 1. Where were you born and what were your parents’ occupations? 2. What was your childhood like? 1. What were some goals you had for yourself as a child? OR 2. What was your dream career as a child? Why? Career 3. I understand, you are an entrepreneur, an author, fitness trainer, a voice for the youth and at the same time you maintain a full-time career in Myanmar. 1. How and why did you come about taking on these positions? 2. Can you give us the details on how you manage to do all these? 3. What do you want to achieve from doing all of this? 4. What do you think are the impacts of your efforts? 4. In the Asian Entrepreneur interview, you answered and I quote: “I’ve been living like a gypsy across Indochina with the intention of saving the world.” Would you please elaborate on what you mean by this? And how do you intend on “saving the world”? 5. Based on our background research, you’re the founder of SoyAi. Can you tell us about the SoyAi and how it came into being? 6. What about the Youth Centre in Myanmar? What influenced you to establish this community? 3 7. I remember you once told me, how you started out with a big group of kids and only ended up with a small number. Was it because their families didn’t support the program or other personal reasons? 8. Based on your previous interview with Myanmar Entrepreneur, you expressed a certain opinion about NGOs. Could you elaborate more on why you feel this way about NGOs? Thinking back 9. What countries have you visited and done work in? Could you please elaborate on those experiences as well as any hardships you may have faced while traveling? 10. In all the countries that you’ve traveled, how are women different from each country? Example, gender equality, women’s rights and other discriminations they may have faced. 11. As a female, did you ever face any racial/ethnic, or gender discrimination? If so, could you elaborate on one experience and how you dealt with the situation? 12. In your own perspective, what are your thoughts on women in Asia and women in the West when it comes to women’s rights and how their culture plays a role? 13. Would you say, in today’s world women are more able to liberate themselves and able to voice their rights? Or is there still a gender gap? 14. As a woman, you have done a lot to create change in your community. In our course, we learned of many situations where “women were agents of social change”. How do you feel about this phrase and do you agree with it? 15. Finally, to end this interview, what is one thing you hope to see in society (in your lifetime or the future)? 4 SECTION THREE (10 points; 2 points each) Answer these questions: 1. Did you get complete answers to your questions? Explain For many of our questions, we got more than complete answers. When Eileen answered our questions, it was like she was telling us a story. Especially when we asked her about how she came to receive the many titles that she had (e.g., entrepreneur, an author). She would include a lot more information than what we were expecting. There were many times where she would think of something relevant to what we were previously talking about and bring it up in the conversation. 2. Was your interview structured, unstructured, or mixed? Explain Our interview was mixed, but a majority of it was structured since we stuck to the questions that we had written down prior to the interview. We moved along the interview by asking one question after another. However, we skipped over some of our questions based on her responses, because sometimes Eileen would provide an extensive recollection of information for one question, but would be sufficient for the following two-three questions. We only asked additional questions when trying to clarify something that she had previously said. 3. What probing questions did you use? Explain All the questions we had were based on the previous research we had done on Eileen. One of the probing questions we had was about her opinions on non-governmental organizations (NGOs) because in a previous interview, she had mentioned that she did not like to be addressed as an NGO. Thus, we decided to ask her to explain more on why she felt that way. Another probing question that we asked was about her experiences in the countries that she had lived in (i.e., Myanmar and Cambodia). Since she is a woman and has experiences being a foreigner in 5 another country, we were interested in whether or not she had experienced any discrimination and if she had experienced difficulty in her work space. In addition, we asked Eileen about topics that we had discussed in class in order to see if her perspective differed from our classmates’ responses. For example, we asked her how she felt about argument on career vs. family for women, since the topic was discussed in class and we thought it would be interesting to see if this argument is also present in other countries beside America. 4. Explain your team approach. That is, who did what? For the most part, we approached the project collaboratively by doing the tasks separately and then we would each add or edit what the other had done. For example, when we were creating the interview questions, Sandy first started the list of interview questions. I added my own questions from the research we had on her and rearranged the questions so that they would transition smoothly when we asked them to her. During the interview, we each switched off to ask Eileen the questions and we took turns to respond to what she said for our questions. For the powerpoint slides, we met together to put all the important parts that we wanted to mention in our slides and then we each did condense the information on a slide (Sandy did process and I did content). Everything was done over google docs so that we could each edit it on our own time. 5. Did the interviewee give you any documents or references to articles to read, or did she mention other people for you to talk to (or research)? Explain Eileen did not give any additional resources to research. She did, however, mention about UNICEF in Myanmar. SECTION FOUR (30 points) 6 Insert your interview notes/write up here. Remember to be accurate and concise. Consider what was said, any emerging trends your interviewee mentioned, different interpretations, and recommendations for follow up interviews. The first two questions that were asked about about Eileen’s childhood. We first asked about where she was born and what her parents did for a living. She spoke about being born in Malaysia and how her parents were teachers. She further clarified what level of education they were working at and their specific positions at the school. We then asked her about her childhood dreams. She laughed while saying how she wanted to be a police woman so that she could catch all the bad guys. To follow up, we asked her what her parents wanted her to be and she said they wanted her to be an accountant or lawyer. In addition to her answer about her parents’ goals for her, she joked about how much she disliked math. Following these two questions, we asked her about her career. Based on our previous research, we knew that she was an entrepreneur, author, fitness trainer, and a voice for the youth. Thus, we asked about how she came about taking on those positions. For this question, she provided us a very long and detailed answer of many events that she had encountered to get where she was now. She was very enthusiastic when she was explaining everything and at certain points, she displayed her frustration with her experiences through changes in tone and eye movements. She talked about many of her achievements, as well as the many issues that occured along the way and her attempts to resolving such issues. Moreover, she recounted many memories that have shaped her into who she is today. Eileen started off by explaining why she was in Myanmar, which was because her husband had gotten transferred there in 2012. She talked about her search for something to do because she didn’t want to be a housewife. She laughed and further added how it was impossible 7 to be a housewife because there was no electricity or water. Following this, she talked about her job at Citi Mart, and about how she wanted to do something more than just work. The first home Eileen found had 26 children and she recounted one instance she had with one of the children. She had asked a girl what she had had for lunch and Eileen exclaimed that they only had papaya salad, emphasizing how ridiculous the situation was. She then talked about how she was introduced to a monastery with 200 children, about her frustration with the adults there, and her disapproval of how everything was related to money. She spoke of one memory where she had donated a TV and started noticing that the moms were charging the children to use the TV, which Eileen had not expect would happen. She then talked about her solution to this problem, which was to create her own youth center. She expressed the difficulties she had with starting it up because of the money, but she then expressed her gratitude and excitement of how her friends and family had supported her through it all. Following this, she talked about how she was done with simply donating her salary, because she didn’t think it was sustainable. She brought up her company called Soyai, which was designated for the 18 year old boys that she was working with. She talked about her frustration with the monks and how they disapproved of her not giving the money and instead making the boys work for it themselves. She even experienced emotional blackmail since the monks would say that they had no money to send the children to her. She recounted her experience of pitching her story to the public about Soyai, about her goals for the company and the very essence of it all. When she talked about all the achievements Soyai had accomplished, especially with the boys themselves, she spoke with honor and was genuinely proud of all the company has gone through to become what it is today. Moreover, she recounts memories of the initial struggles of getting the company started and the many experiences she had with the boys. 8 After Mrs. Lui spoke about her career, we asked her further probing questions based on our research, like about her opinions on NGOs. She described her disapproval of NGOS, like UNICEF, for using donations for administrational things, like paintings in an office. She contrasted herself from these NGOs, since she was using 100% of the donations for the children, because it felt weird to not be giving it all back to the deserving recipients. She also mentioned an experience she had when she tried to bring up an issue to UNICEF, regarding the government obstructing the ability for boys to attend school. For an organization that receives so much money, she never heard back from them about her issue. Once we heard everything about her opinions and history of her career, we asked for her opinions about topics that were talked about in class. Based on the way she recounted her memories, Eileen expressed herself as a very strong and independent woman, who was persistent in her determination to create change in her local community. With that said, we asked her if she had ever experienced discrimination (as both a female and foreigner) in the many countries she had visited in South Asia. Eileen then recounted her frustration as a foreigner and efforts to fight the system that was already present in the community. This is very similar to the experiences of the women we had read about in class. She also added how she was stereotyped as a woman since people expected her to be emotional and would judge her for her appearance. We then asked her about her opinions on the discussion between having a career and having a family. She used her own experiences to express that there shouldn’t be an opportunity to choose, because people should just do what they need to do. If they think they should focus on their career right now, they should, instead of listening to what other people have to say. She further added that people must first change their mindset, and change the ideas that people are being brought up with. She believes that because women are raised a certain way, it is almost like they are 9 brainwashed and this consequently impacts how they would act in the future. In other words, women become stuck in these categories/boxes. Despite the strong impression she gave off, she also believes that women who are fighting the system are still a minority, and that there are still not a lot of women that are trying to end gender inequality. As a conclusion, Eileen didn’t provide recommendations for a follow-up, but she did leave a final message. She believes that without changing the mindsets that people are raised with, there will be a very slow change in terms of gender equality. Section Five: Your Analysis: We’ve gained a tremendous respect and admiration for her work. In today’s world, it’s hard to find people like Eileen. Creating her own safe haven for underprivileged children in Myanmar and reassuring them that there’s hope in life is what makes Eileen unique from other individuals. Knowing the fact that she is not a member of any organizations such as the U.N or the NGOs and that she works alone with the help of her friends and families shows that this is her true passion. She’s doing all of this out of kindness and her true desire to eradicate poverty. To us this is more meaningful than anything else. Judging from her responses, it is clear Eileen is not the type to give up easily once her mind is her on a goal. She has many potentials, dreams and hopes for the kids in her youth center. Throughout this interview, we don’t believe there were any aspects that were not useful. Since we did not have sufficient time, we would have like to know more in details of her other trips to Cambodia and Vietnam. Also, what other programs or ideas does she have in mind for the children in Myanmar? It would be interesting to know if she has plans to build her own organization and help all the other children in the Southeast Asia as well. 10 From our class presentations, the presentation on Dr. Ling Ling Ho was interesting to observe. She is currently the head researcher for University of Wisconsin. She witnessed the era of the Chinese civil war. Hearing the story from a first person is much more fascinating than reading it from the books. It’s scary to know that back then the only way to stay alive and be safe was by joining the Chinese army. Children were on the streets and had no educational opportunities. It was risky and dangerous for her to be seen with her Western (British) boyfriend in public during the civil war because it was a period when China was anti-Western. The other presentation we also liked was on Sarah-Ann Smith. She was an ex-foreign service officer for the U.S government at China and Taiwan. She was also a professor at the University of South Carolina. Her role as a diplomat developed a better understanding relationship between Taiwan and the U.S; help people understand each other. The most interesting thing to find out from this presentation was that Sarah-Ann was the fifth woman in the U.S Foreign Service. Other groups did a fantastic job on their presentations as well. Overall, this course has given us a lot of knowledge about women and the movements and revolutions they’ve started or contributed to. Katie and I can agree that after completing this course we have a better understanding on how history has a big impact on today’s society. It’s all a big wave of movement. If the women we learned about in class didn’t take the initiative, then we (women) would still be living in a male dominated world. 11 (1)
• Tani Barlow AAS 307 Interview Presented by: Anqi Li Shangqing Zheng Content Tani Barlow is a Professor of Humanities and Professor of History at Rice University. Her focus is Chinese Intellectual and women’s history. Question: What inspired you to pursue a career in Modern Chinese history and Women’s Studies? Did you have any family influences that affected your decision? Question: What are one or two of your proudest professional accomplishments? “That’s very difficult to answer. I’m very proud of writing books. Very very proud. Because that’s the most difficult thing I did. I also proud of journal that I founded and I edit it. It involves a lot of people, so I can extend positive influences by helping other people to publish their work, and I like that very much. Those are two things I’m very proud of” Process -We interviewed Professor Tani Barlow on April 10 at 3: 10 PM. The interview lasted 37 minutes. -The objective for the interview was to learn about her career as a professor of Humanities and a scholar of Chinese History and further understand women’s roles in US-China relations. -We prepared 8 questions based on her CV and sent to her two days before the interview and eventually asked 12 questions: both open-ended and probing questions - Our Interview questions included her early life(family and education), teaching experience, visits in China, and understanding in US-China relations. -Nonverbal cues: Eye contact; Smiling; Laughing (1)

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